News-Record.com

I've always strove to be a moderate as a philosophical matter. That said I don't think the term moderate, liberal, or conservative is worth the electrons it takes to broadcast it on this forum. I'm not going to get into bashing Bush (that will come later) but most of this forum is dedicated to bashing Conservatives & especially Liberals without defining what that means. I would contend that it means absolutely nothing.

Lately more people that call themselves liberals are preaching balanced budgets & people that call themselves conservatives say it doesn't matter. The right to privacy is supported by people on both ends of the spectrum as is the the counter argument.

To disagree with the writer, George Bush is a weak president. It's hard to think of any part of our country that isn't worse off because of his leadership. Terrorist are thriving because of his leadership. The irrational Iraq policy has played into their hands. The splintering of the Western Alliance has played into their hands. The divisions in this country have strengthened them. The pitiful response in New Orleans has showned what he's done to the military by over extending them needlessly.

It takes more than never admiting fault to making a strong leader. Staying the course means less than chosing the right course in the first place.

We can only be left to sigh and ask ourselves "WWBD?" If we only had Bill Clinton as President, everything would be just fine.

Good letter,Mr.Matthews. I have found out in my daily contact with people who call themselves "moderates" 90% are indeed falming liberals. I have come to the conclusion that they think if they call themselves moderate,then they condsider themselves "above the fray"so to speak. But this is a strategy to deflect any critizism from either the left or right.(imo) Altough I rarely comment in this forum,I see it daily here in these posts.

I used to consider myself a moderate with a left leaning tilt. But as I grew older and and having seen some of the results that liberalism has wrought on this country,( a public education system that graduates some students that cannot cope with simple math and algebra problems, our churches are ridiculed beyond belief, A transfer of 1 trillion dollars from the producers to the non-producers with no sign of improvment,etc.)I now consider myself a conserative and make no bones about it.

There are many issues that I dissagree with the Bush adm.on,but when I considered the choices we had,there is little doubt that he was (is) by far the best that we were offered.

The liberals who are preaching about a balanced budget are doing so to try to score political points with the "moderates",IMO. Since when did the left give a whip about reigning in federal spending? It began when they saw the federal defecit grow due to the war on terror and they saw this as a chance to attack Bush in hopes of gaining some political high ground.

"It takes more than admitting fault to be a strong leader"? No,it takes a leader who does not believe in himself and listenes to the latest polls to make policy decisions. So far Bush has stayed the course and hopefully he will continue to do so.

Mr.Matthews states: "I shudder to think where this country would be with Al Gore or John Kerry as president". While there is no way to know what would have happened, I will offer my humble opinion. We would most likley have waited for the UN to act in the aftermath of 9/11 and we (most of us) know what that would have ammounted to-ziltch. We would still be watching Saddam thumb his nose at the world and filling the mass graves with his fellow citizens who opposed his views. We would most likley be waiting on endless "studies" to report to president Kerry as to what we did wrong to make the terrorists want to hurt us in the first place,etc,etc....

" The liberals who are preaching about a balanced budget are doing so to try to score political points with the "moderates",IMO."

Precisely draftee. And conservatives that say deficits don't matter are doing the same thing. So what does conservative and liberal mean?

Nothing!

It's lovely when folks pretend to know what so and so would do as President & then knocks it down. Hard to argue the point. Fool that I was, I would have never anticipated invading Iraq as a response to 9/11.

Crying over the mass graves that Saddam was filling and ignoring the mass graves that this war has created is convenient for argument but ignores the fact that we were supporting this monster when he was filling those mass graves. Much of Iraq is worse off now than when Saddam was in power (a sorry statement but true). Perhaps in 5 years that won't be true. I hope so.

"The pitiful response in New Orleans has showned what he's done to the military by over extending them needlessly."

The response time in NO had not one thing to do with an overextended military. It had all to do with POOR PLANNING on the part of the MAYOR of NO and the GOVERNOR of La.. Follow me on this. Days before Katrina hit NO the NWS and NOAA all were telling the people along the Gulf Coast that the biggest hurricane they had seen in a long time was coming ashore and would be there in about 3days. Ok, now pretend for a moment that you are the Mayor of NO and the Governor of La. What would your reaction be. 1. If you were the Mayor, you would get out your evacuation plan and put it into action. Part of this plan should have included a sufficient number of police or help in evacuating people and also enough folks to keep order. The Mayor should have and probably did realize that he didn't have enough people to do both. 2. Now you realize you don't have enough help and you call the Governor and say, listen Gov, we have to evacutate this city and I don't have enough folks on hand to do it plus I am going to need extra help to keep order here so how about calling up the Guard (which is the responsibility of the Gov. not the President of the US) and having them down here close enough to get this program underway today. Also have enough on standby , real close in case we need some more help.
Needless to say, none of this was done until Katrina hit and by then it was too late. The Mayor's SOS came 2 days after the storm hit.
Now lets go to the Governor. The Gov realizes that there are only 4 to 6 thousand NG troops available to go to NO to help so the next step should have been calling the Prez, not to insure that there was going to be some money available but to insure that there was going to be some back up for the NG in La. The Gov talked to the Prez 2 days prior to the storm and talked so the government could get money flowing into the state. The Gov. failed to ask for military backup. Now, the Prez, under most conditions and this is one of them, cannot just arbitarily send in the military with out the request or consent of the state.

Well , the storm hits, chaos breaks out and the Mayor nor the Gov have a clue as what went wrong so now they call for Military back up. Well the CG and Navy was already in action doing evac's but there was no one to do law and order because the Plan did not call for enough help to do both evac and law and order.It is not politically expedient for the mayor to preserve law and order so evac and rescue could happen. So now you have to fire up the Army, Regular and Reserves and have them load up enough food and water to take care of what the Gov and Mayor extimated as a hundred thousand (actually in the beginning it was less than one hundred thousand according to the Mayor and Gov). Do you have a clue how long it takes to put together that many personnel and that much supply and get it moving much less get it there over flooded roads, no roads, blocked roads? Well face it ,it sure ain't happening overnight.
So now where does that leave us. It leaves some folks blaming the Federal government because they are so dependent on the Feds doing so much they expect them to do everything. Where it actually leaves the situation is that the Mayor failed to either have a plan or prosecute his plan correctly. The Gov. who is in hiding evidently since she has sent out the Lt Gov to speak for her, failed because there was no plan or the plan was not sufficient to fill the bill. Yes, Washington failed too because once the storm hit, a plan of action, which we now see was insufficient for the enormity of the disaster, had no back up plan and had to make one up as they went along. There has never been a plan of action to take into consideration anything of this magnitude. What plan there may have been was not sufficient even for a small disaster much less one that spread over 3 states. The blame is wide spread and begins at the lowest level and move from there but it in no way has anything to do with where and how the military is dispersed. The biggest failure is like in the movie with Steve McQueen, made in La by the way, where the warden stated, "What we have here, is a failure to communicate." And that my friend sums it all up in a nut shell. There was a definite failure to communicate starting three days before Katrina hit and it started with the office of Mayor in NO and moved up.

Marshall,

With all due disrespect, you are an idiot! If Bush is a weak leader in your opinion I can imagine what a pitiful leader you would be. It is hard for you to think of "any part of the country that isn't worse off because of his leadership" because you don't think. You hate Marshall. Every post by you in this forum for any letter contains your hatred for Bush. It is not a conservative or liberal issue as you pointed out, it is honesty issue. If you were'nt so blinded by hate then maybe you could get past the DNC talking points and post an intelligent letter to this forum. Bush is by no means a perfect President as none are, but to hear you tell it he is completely worthless and that is just intellectual vacancy or dishonesty. Grow up and offer solutions instead of just whining about how crappy the country is due to Bush's Presidency.

Hate to say it, but I agree with mrproduce on this one. Yes, the Federal gov't has responded slowly, but why was it the Federal government's responsibility?

Was it the country's responsibility to ensure that the levees were up to snuff? Are the levees protecting the borders of the United States? No. They were (nominally, at least) protecting the city of New Orleans. I don't expect the Federal gov't to fix my house for me when in falls into disrepair; I know that's my responsibility as a homeowner. The blame for the failure of the levees falls squarely on the shoulders of the municipal goverment -- and, by extension, the people -- of New Orleans. It's *their* city to protect.

Is it the Country's responsibility to give the city of New Orleans a disaster plan for a disaster they've known was in the making for years? No. While the governement obviously has a responsiblity to provide manpower and money in such an extreme event, it was the responsibility of the city of New Orleans and the state of Louisiana to compose such a plan -- with the help of FEMA and other agencies -- and make sure the resources were in place to execute it. They've had years of advance warning that such an event was likely to occur, and they knew Katrina had her eye set on them well in advance as well.

I'm not a fan of Bush or his administration, but stop blaming them for everything that goes wrong in this country and the world. The buck stops at the mayor's and governor's doorsteps, and the people of New Orleans have to take some measure of responsiblity, too.

Not to rub salt on an open wound.

"What does conserative and liberal mean?" Well without getting into the dictionary meaning and speaking in a political sense, I'd say that conseratives stand for a strong military where as liberals want to cut the military budget at every oppurtunity and turn over the security of the country to the UN. The liberals trumpet social programs like welfare as a great success where conseratives see it as a shakle around the neck of those living from cradle to grave on a system that allows them only enough to live in a lifestyle comprable to third world countries. On the other hand conseratives feel that for one to work and earn one's keep is a matter of pride and it creates self confidence. Not to mention the trillion dollars it has sapped from the producers of this country.

"Crying over mass graves". I wasn't crying over mass graves. Don't put ideas in my mouth. (another liberal tactic). I was stating a fact.

As for stating my opinion about what president Kerry or Gore would have done, That is my OPINION. Here is another opinion: insted of taking action to protect this country they would most likley be bowing at the feet of Kopi Annan(sp?) and begging the UN to send the little blue helmeted rapists over to afganistan to beg ubl to not attack us any more.

JFK was the last elected liberal democrat to have any spine at all and in today's world he would be considered a conserative. IMO, of course! Too bad his backbone has not been passed on to his decendants.

As for the NO situation, I would hate to see the retoric in the press had the mayor there been a conserative republican. That's all I will say on that matter as mrproduce has covered that pretty well I think.

One point to note, had the 2nd levee not broken through, the devastation of New Orleans would not have been what it is. That is why the Emergency Action Plan for New Orleans failed. That is when State and Federal assistance were needed. And with all the rhethoric given thus far, the questions still remain unanswered.

And has anyone taken any good looks at the people who are/were left in New Orleans? If not, do so! If so, explain exactly how someone without the resources could have evacuated theirself?

And how about seeing the personnel being evacuated from Tulane University Medical Center while medical personnel were on top of a parking garage at Charity Hospital (across the street from Tulane) waiting to evacuate patients! They were keeping the patient I saw alive using a manually operated air bag. Now what is more important, personnel or a patient needing life support? That question should not even have to be asked.

Shalom

Mr.P,

There is no argument that poor planning is the major problem here, on a local, state, and national level. This is a senerio that has been gamed for years but when the time came authorities froze.

I don't understand how you can say having 40% of the LA Nat Guard and associated equiptment in Iraq doesn't affect the situation. It's not the only factor and I never said that it was, but I'll bet everybody involved in the effort would have loved to had them a few miles away on Monday and their equipment in place. The problem here wasn't that we didn't get adequate forces to the area but didn't get them there quickly enough to mitigate most of this tragedy.

Blaming the mayor after the fact makes no sense (before the fact certainly) for the problem overstripped his resources. Not having a full national guard gave the governor a more limited ability to move force quickly. Under your theory if LA had no National Guard at all then that also would have had no effect on the situation.

Also, who need a call from a Mayor or a Governor to realize what magnitude of need there was in NO? Your communication senerio doesn't work in that sense. If I knew the day after what a hellhole NO and surrounding areas were, why didn't the folks in charge of mobilizing the response? Of course they did. I was surprised as to how quickly order broke down, not the looting particuarly, but the intense violence, but a strong military presence should have been organized before the storm had hit and deployed soon after.

This was a case years of neglect caught up with us and not having a system in place to handle what was, given time, a certain occurance is nothing short of criminal.

"Was it the country's responsibility to ensure that the levees were up to snuff?"

It must be, for the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers is in charge of maintaining them.
-------------------------------------
J.C.

Thanks for your mature letter. I think you upheld the "conservative" teams standards well.

-------------------------------------

"We would still be watching Saddam thumb his nose at the world and filling the mass graves with his fellow citizens who opposed his views."

draftee, if "crying" was overstating it I apologize(hmmmm another liberal tactic).

" The pitiful response in New Orleans has showned what he's done to the military by over extending them needlessly."

I am simply amazed at the ignorance of people when it comes to understanding military logistics and the failure to understand the scope of devestation this storm produced. There is nothing in the history of the United States to use for a comparison.

Bush called the LA. Gov. on Sat. and asked her for a mandatory evac. of N.O. and Bush declared a state of emergency for the Gulf Coast on Sat. This placed the NG in those areas on alert.

Hurricane hit Monday. Assessement happens on Tues-Wed. Orders given on Tues-Wed, then 24 hours for assembly and load up, then another 24 hours travel time. Federal started arriving arrived enmass at daylight on Friday morning.

Cost guard and Army choppers were there on Tuesday.

New Orleans was pitfully unprepared for a Hurricane. A large portion of the blame for this belongs to the Landreiu family. US Senator Mary Landrieu and LA Lt.governor Mitch Landrieu belong to a family that is as powerful in LA as the Kennedy's are in Mass. Her father, Moon Landrieu, was Mayor of New Orleans in the 70's when I lived there and has been behind the scenes city leader ever since. For Senator Landrieu to blame the "powers that be" for the lack of hurricane prepardedness is the epitomy of hypocrisy as her family has been the "powers that be" in New Orleans for the past 35 years.

I did not think conservative or liberal meant anything Marshall. In fact you said it meant "absolutely nothing." I am not on any team. I can stand on my own quite sufficiently.

You'll get no argument from me about the Landrieu family being a powerhouse in La. but I don't blame them or anyone else for the poor planning. What can one expect from a natural disaster of this magnituse? No one could have predicted the devistation of this hurricane. I have a sister who lives in Ca. on the fault line. Is she prepared for the next earthquake? Of course she is. As much as the people of NO was for this storm. In order for the people to have been evacuated to an extent that it would have been minimal dammage the process would have had to begun a week or two before the fact. I would have loved to hear the protests from people two weeks before the storm if they were told they had to leave their homes because there may be a hurricane in a couple of weeks. Point is, this is a natural disaster and was no one's fault. And trying to pin the blame on "a lack of NG troops" is just plain BS.

OK, enough finger pointing for now at least. What NEEDS to be done now is for the TOTAL and COMPLETE evacuation of New Orleans to HAPPEN. Get the people back to some sense of normalcy. Then, start reconnecting family's. And lastly, start recovery efforts of the dead.

Get the work done NOW, then worry about who to blame and for what later!

Shalom

I am amazed that anyone can defend, or even attempt to defend, our Government's response to a natural disaster like the one in New Orleans. It is impossible to even wrap my mind around that. This was Homeland Security's first test since 911 and they have failed miserably. Our Government's job is not to be a "backup" in a natural disaster, but to be front line while city and state's provide back up, hence the reason FEMA was developed. Are you also suggesting mrproduce that local Governments assume the role of FEMA as well? According to Homeland Security, local Government's are responsible for "first responders", which I do agree were horribly absent, but do you really believe that it is a local Government's job to evacuate, care for, house , and feed 1,000,000 people? The bottom line is that the Bush Administration failed miserably, and as a taxpayer I am outraged.

Our "strong" president has screwed up literally everything he has been involved in. I think the question "Are we better off than we were four years ago" can be answered NO.

Liberals such as I believe we should keep a strong and able military, but we should only use them if it's absolutely necessary. Fighting in Iraq wasn't necessary.

We believe in cooperation and strengthening world alliances, not smashing them to bits with arrogant smirks.

We believe letting people run their own lives, free from government intervention. We believe in a smaller government, not a larger one. (totally opposite of the conservative point of view)

We wouldn't have cut funding to the New Orleans levee projects by 80% by funneling that money into a losing war overseas.

There are stark differences between liberals and conservatives.

I think we can all agree that poor planning was involved here, but even if we had never heard the word "hurricane" in this country, nor knew what one could do, don't you think 5 days is too long to get help to these poor souls? Five days! Inexcusable by all means!

I agree with Jeff that Charles is not in the middle based on his letter but Jeff is about as much in the middle as Charles is based on his letter.

Hugh
I find it interesting that of all the politicians from NO and LA. who probably all share an equal part in this for not doing what was needed before this happened that you nicely picked out only democrats. I guess that means all the republicans are beyond criticism or blame. Bu since many here feel that Bush and the repubs walk on water why should I be surprised.

I dont know if the governor is dem or repub and quite frankly I dont care because it makes no difference to me but you put out this nice time line. My question was and has been since tuesday;knowing this massive storm was coming and given that many were predicting the worst then WHY DIDNT THEY HAVE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE WITHIN AN HOURS DISTANCE AWAY TO GET IN THERE AT THE FIRST POSSIBLE MOMENT WITH AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE AND NOT ON FRIDAY?(The bold letters are only there to highlight the question nothing more).

"I did not think conservative or liberal meant anything Marshall."

That might explain the quotes I put around conservative J.C. However since you didn't declare yourself it was wrong of me to put you on a team. My apologies to people calling themselves conservatives. Didn't mean to link J.C. with you.

Did pass the duck test though. (;-}

excuse me, Jeff, but you are still rationalizing the illegal invasion & occupation of Iraq with the 9/11 argument. get your head out of the sand! the word 'terrorist' has been overused ad nauseum since 2001; in the wake of hurricane Katrina, the *true* terrorists are the Right Wingers who stole the whitehouse and purged the FEMA funding, ignoring the warnings of such a catastrophe. I'm not forgiving of the spineless left who rolled over at the 2000 and 2004 elections, but you CANNOT and MUST NOT hang this Iraq thing on 9/11. IMHO, if Bush et al had not seized occupation of 1600 PA Ave., NY & DC would not have been the targets they became. our further occupation of Iraq has no justification whatsoever beyond lining pockets of cronies, just like all the tax cuts that have been their domestic response.

Hayes, You brought the democrats into my conversation. I was only pointing out Mary Landrieu's hypocrisy.

The La. leadership has shown nothing but incompetance with regard to their response to this disaster. Fact be know it was Bush who "ordered" the Evacuation when called and pressured the Governor to take action.

NOLA.com

As I said earlier, you people questioning why it took 3 days for the first convoys of N.G. to arrive in New Orleans are utterly and completely ignorant of military matters regarding logistics and mission deployment. Thank-God the adults are in charge.

All you folks who are so concerned about late arriving aid, please sent your checks in immediately. Don't be cheap for you will be paying for a long, long time.

The State of Louisiana had an evacuation plan that was executed with less than 24 hours before Hurricane force winds hit the city. The state knew what was coming a full year before this storm hit.

http://www.ohsep.louisiana.gov/plans/EOPSupplement1a.pdf

Why did the Governor procratstinate so long before ordering the evacuation and activating the National Guard?

NOAA weather predicted New Orleans as ground zero at least by 11:00 pm Friday Night, a full 36 hours before a mandatory evacuation was ordered and 54 hours before hurricane force winds hit the city.

This was an act of gross negligence and incompetance on part of the Governor and Mayor of N.O., IMO.

Hugh
I brought the dems into it because you seem to always go off on the liberals in this country for what is wrong with it and now there is a catestrophe and I just find it odd the only people you mention and to lay blame for it are democrats.

Second the last I look I was an adult and sorry but they saw this coming,there was a small window there in which they could have put more in place;closer to the area and have a better reaction time. I dont blame the military or national guard they can do nothing until given marching orders from the politicians.

Third you have the luxury to view this threeday wait as sufficient. Question is how sufficient would you find it if you were one of those there and waiting?

It's not that George W. Bush should be hated... rather, he's a man who is not trustworthy and competent, especially with the highest office in the land.

The only reason he got this far is because of his family connections, and because he happened to be affiliated with a powerful political party. There was nothing about his personal character that merited being given this kind of responsibility. He was practically *picked* by the party bosses to be their nominee, set against whoever the Democrats picked. None of them were all that really attractive so far as leadership qualities go.

But like good little sheep, enough American people did not think for themselves about who they were electing, they had become so used to a political party thinking for them. They elected who they were expected to elect, nothing more. That's what our political system has become. Gone are the days when any kid could grow up believing he (or she) could be President of the United States. Sorry kid, but unless you have the right family connections and are willing to be a tool of the party, you won't be allowed to go that far.

George W. Bush just happened to have been a kid born with all the right assets already in place: he didn't bring anything of his own to the table, except a lot of character flaws: he's a compulsive liar. He's a liar who has no desire to repent of his lying. Why should I believe he's really a fellow Christian then? Why at all? He used falsehoods to get us into the war with Iraq and now he cannot decide what the reason was that we went in to begin with (in case nobody got the memo, he's now saying it was to secure Iraqi oil fields). He uses people: he literally made sure he was facing the cameras with those kids in Mississippi yesterday. A lot of people I know saw that, thought it was pretty obvious he was posing for the cameras. He tries to destroy people who disagree with him. He doesn't apologize, has even said he never has to apologize... well then, has he ever apologized to God for anything? If he can't apologize to his fellow man, why should we believe he can apologize to God? He's made out to be the paragon of Christian virtue... but he doesn't worship with his fellow Christians, something the apostle Paul told us not to forsake. Why, are we beneath his dignity to worship God alongside of? He associated himself with people who could only be described as wicked and iniquitous: Karl Rove, for one. Why would any good Christian actively have anything to do with someone who's entire life has been spent destroying others for something so meaningless as political power? Karl Rove may be the most evil "political consultant" in history... what is Christian about having hired him? Bush is a scoundrel when it comes to the public treasury that's been entrusted to him: he doesn't see the money we give government as a sacred trust, but rather his personal hoard to be raided for whatever crosses his mind. He does not admit his mistakes, and he does not show sympathy for those who have suffered and even died for his mistakes. Not *once* has he visited the graveside of one who has died in Iraq. He asks the young people of America to sacrifice their time for a "noble cause" but does not ask the same of his own children. He has been shown to use some of the worst language and obscene hand gestures without shame. He is a narcissist who believes that everything in the universe exists for sake of himself...

...and yet for all of this he is supposed to be a great Christian leader.

Why should I believe that he is a great Christian man? What virtues does he have that anyone could point to and convince me that he's worth believing this of? Why should I give him any special consideration in my prayers, when I cannot but believe that he is not even really President at all, but was put there by the schemes of others? Why, indeed?

I am expecting the only answers that will be given to this are "What would you have expected of Kerry?" or "At least he's not Clinton" or somesuch. We aren't talking about Clinton, or Kerry. We are discussing the man who is in the Oval Office now, and whether or not he is indeed a great man.

Twenty years from now, Bush will be regarded as the worst President in American history. Those who supported him, will be seen as fools. Why should I not beleive this to be true?

Hayes, I would have got out of the city on my own. #1 rule in an urban disaster is to get away from populated areas ASAP, even if you have to walk.

To those that think being liberal is opposite of the way you, calling yourselves conservative, think: I identify myself as rational; most of you call me a "flaming liberal" because I oppose the horrendous journey Bush has taken my beloved America on. You don't care where I stand on anything, only that I oppose Bush.

I believe in a strong military. I supported the attack aganist Afganistan because there was a rational reason for attacking them. There were only trumped up reasons for attacking the sovereign country of Iraq.

I believe in being responsible in national spending. I think borrowing 75% of our money from China is irresponsible and dangerous. I don't want my grandchildren to have to try and repay hundreds of billions of dollars we borrowed to finance a war that should never have been started.

I believe in personal responsibility. If one cannot afford to buy something not associated with shelter, food or earning a living without exceeding one's income, they should pass on it.

I believe parents should assume responsibility for raising their children or not have them. This includes teaching personal responsibility, religion, respect, honor, the value of empathy and hard work. Parents should not expect society to do this.

I believe it is financially irresponsibile and morally wrong to hand out freebies to illegal immigrants. When they have earned the right to be here, they should qualify for assistance on a temporary basis.

I believe anyone may need a helping hand on a temporary basis and therefore be given one. But giving should have limitations in regards to welfare. Unless a person shows a willingness to help themselves, they should be cut off from public assistance. And there need to be an enforce time limit for public assistance if the person receiving PA is physically/mentally able to work.

I believe in the separation of church and state. Our constitution, agreed or not, is our guide for our form of government.

I believe our members of congress are public servants, hired by the American people and answerable to their employers. That means they have a responsibility to do what is in the best interest of all of us, not just the rich and powerful.

I believe it is wrong, wrong, wrong for a rich, powerful development company to seize the property of anyone for financial gain. I think the supreme court made a big mistake by siding with big business.

I believe charity begins at home, here in the USA. If we can't put enough police on our streets to make them safe, if we can't put enough teaches in our classrooms to teach what our children need to learn to survive, if we cannot provide healthcare for our children and elderly, if we cannot provide the means to feed, clothe and shelter our young, if we cannot provide enough military to keep our borders secure, then we need to re-evaluate our priorities.

To me, it is like being in the middle of the ocean on a boat with your family. Your family's weight is the maximum capacity weight for the boat. There appears a multitude of people in the ocean crying "Help me. Help me." Now knowing that taking these people on will capsize the boat and you, your family and the ones you are trying to save will all drown, would you take them onboard? No one benefits if you exceed your resources, everyone dies.

Someone needs to be considering our (the nation's) best interest and be strong enough to say "I will pray for you but my family is my responsibility.". Is this selfish? Perhaps. But it is rational and human to put family first.

But, as I said, all I need to do to be labeled a liberal is disagree with Bush.

Mr. P, I must disagree with your hypothesis. Bush declared a national emergency for NO before the storm hit. Why would the governor of LA think she needed to ask for help afterwards? The national emergency plan had already been initiated. I would have thought that meant PLANS for a national emergency were already in place. Apparently she and I were wrong. This, however, does not excuse those in the higest office for being so slow to respond.

If Bush and his family were in the midst of the situation I have no doubt it WOULD NOT have taken five days for them to receive help. And he would not have been so presumptous as to say "...what the people have to understand is...".

"Liberals want a smaller government"? Yeah,they want a smaller government when the conseratives are running it,but when a liberal is at the helm,it is full speed ahead.

Epa- liberal program that has shackled oil exploration in this country for fear it might upset a damn bug's nest somewhere.

Social security- liberal program that has our seniors living in 3rd world conditions,and can't afford medacine,therefore creating other entitlement programs.

The welfare state- liberal program that allows people to suck the blood of the producers while doing nothing productive except to vote for the democrats.

Food stamp act- liberal program that allows recipents to sell their stamps for a reduced rate and but booze,drugs,whatever with the cash. (again sucking the blood from the producers)

And an ATTEMPT to federalize health care in this country by the Clinton's and thereby putting the entire country under the control of the federal government.

Liberals want a smaller government? I could wear the keyboard out trying to name all the liberal programs that have been enacted in the name of compassipon,but has done very little to help anyone at all.

Liberals want a smaller government all right, they want to reduce it by 1- George Bush.

Yvonne, barring the Iraq war you sound like a conservative. I always knew you had good qualities.

For all you arm chair quarterbacking about everything that went wrong with the hurricane aftermath: donate money first then you can sit there and whine. These people need our help, they couldn't really give a shit right now about Christopers Knights novel on the evils of Bush.

The government will do it's best to deal with this unprecedented catastrophe, but it is the genorosity of the American people who will rebuild hope, homes and lives. It will be carpenters, plumbers, engineers, road pavers, roofers, etc. who rebuild, not a president, senator, governor, or mayor.

All you hear in the media is how the government screwed everything up. What you don't hear is that Americans donated over $70 million to the Red Cross this week. You don't hear about the countless American families who have taken hurricane victims into their homes to live.

So please switch your browser off this blog for awhile and donate money. Do it BEFORE you go fill up your gas tank!! It will make you feel better.

DONATE MONEY! and whatever else you can.

First, in draftee's last post, the phrase, "liberals want a smaller government," I do not know where this came from. It is in quotation, however, in searching this blog, it is not found anywhere except in that post. I do not know the context of what/where this came. And due to it only appearing in that post, I am reluctant to trust the authority of it.

Last, for those whinning about those who feel the Federal government has "dropped the ball" in responding to the Gulf Coast disaster, get a grip. I have seen it in several posts noting for those peole who felt the Fed "dropped the ball" to give their contributions and be quite. First, it is going to take giving from all people. So, before one suggests for another to give, one needs to give as well! There are thousands upon thousands who have no home, etc., to return to, so show just a little compassion.

Further, were it you or I there in New Orleans and that general area, we may very well be acting out in the same manner. Remember, "there but by the grace of God go I."

Shalom

Darryl,check Brian Harper's post at 10:58 for the libs want a smaller gov.line.

I agree with the rest of your post. We all should give to the disaster relief fund. My favorite is the salvation army,but there are many,many good charaties involved.

Darryl, How right you are! Living in NC should give one a greater appreciation of "There but for the grace of God go I" since we are only one hurricane away from disaster.

Dan, It is most presumptuous of you to assume I have not already donated. It is also rude of you to tell me to do anything, especially to insinuate I just sit in front of "my browser" and do nothing but whine. Below is my response from another thread:

Dan, Does my criticism of the delayed response have merit only if I have made a donation? You see, I thought I was expressing a legitimate concern, not whining. I am sorry you chose to see it in a negative light. Of course, it is exactly what I expect anytime anyone utters anything but praise for Bush.

My paltry $100 donation out of this paycheck and another $100 earmarked out of the next one (in two weeks) may not meet your requirement but perhaps someone in LA or MS will appreciate it. And I have requested to be able to take vacation time to go there to help out in a medical capacity. It is not looking good because we have to request time off twelve weeks in advance. Plus, our hospital is so small it is hard to find coverage on such short notice. But I have faith that God will use me in whatever way He sees fit.

Perhaps, Dan, you should ask and wait for an answer before proceeding with criticism.

. And with all the rhethoric given thus far, the questions still remain unanswered.

I believe I answered the question on the levy breaks rather well DArryl. Having been stationed there and in Kessler during Camille I had first hand knowledge of the levys. In 69 they were at best for a Cat 3 storm. Little or nothing has been done as I beleive the person who lived there in the early 70's will attest too, to imporove the levys. The money was there, but was spent evidently to do a thing in way of building up these sinking levys. For who ever stated abouto an 80% cut in funding for levy's , facts please and not just pulling numbers out of the air. At least first hand information is better than gazing into the crystal ball and coming up with 80%. Horsefeathers!!

Marshall, my point was that the governor nor the mayor made full use of the NG troops until after the fact. The numbers in that perspecitive are irrelevant. 4000 troops would have gone a long way had they been called in early enough, Fact, they weren't. Results, chaos!
The whole thing boils down to, as I stated earlier, "what we had here was a lack of communication". and that was from the gitgo.

And fingers continually get pointed while innocent people suffer.

Shalom

If you think President Bush is a weak leader, you have that right. But that's just your opinion, and it's no more right or wrong than mine.
I happen to think he's a great leader.
The rest of you are not required to agree.

Hugh
Due to being pushed out the door by my wife to go to a party, I was not able to add some things.
First since you indicated you lived there I hope that any friends or family you may have there that you have recieved some form of good news.

Also my criticism is at all politicians and I agree fully with your post at 101pm. I was not able to read it until later. This doesnt mean there arent those you may share a bigger part here as maybe the senator and family you mentioned. being from there you would know more about that than me so I was not trying to contradict you there as I have no reason to or knowledge to do that.

Dan
Maybe you need to tune into CNN International. Everything you said isnt there I have seen. And even the Aaron Brown show has done some very good pieces on famililies helping others.

I can answer this on, by: histrion:

"Yes, the Federal gov't has responded slowly, but why was it the Federal government's responsibility?"

The answer is from The Department of Homeland Security web site: One of three stated core missions is to "Minimize the damage from potential attacks and natural disasters".

The DHS had four years to plan and have spent a hundred billion dollars ....

Draftee:

"EPA - liberal program that .... " was established by the NIXON administation.

fwiw, I personally think ALL oil exploration in this country should be shackled - save it for later.

"Social Security - liberal program ... " true .. that was initially set up to counter the 25% unemployment rate of the Depression. As for "our seniors living in 3rd world conditions", we ain't seen nothing yet, and as for "can't afford medicine," .. wait until you see what the new program has in store for us .. it's so slanted to the Pharm' industry it's sickening.

"The welfare state - liberal program that ... " I'm generally with you on this. there are exceptional cases, but mostly I agree it's not a good thing.

"Food stamp act - liberal program that .... " see abive, but your premise of "allows recipents to sell their stamps for a reduced rate and but booze, drugs, whatever with the cash." has little basis in reality.

"And an ATTEMPT to federalize health care .... " ... see above about ".. wait until you see what the new program has in store for us .. it's so slanted to the Pharm' industry it's sickening."

"I could wear the keyboard out trying to name all the liberal programs that have been enacted ... but [have] done very little to help anyone at all."
... and you could also "... wear the keyboard out trying to name all the [Conserative] programs that ... but [have] done very little to help anyone at all."

Back on topic:

"US forces crushed insurgents in Tal Afar last fall, leaving only about 500 American soldiers behind and handing over control to the Iraqis. But Iraqi authorities lost control of the city, and insurgent ranks swelled."

and Yesterday: "Insurgents killed 19 Iraqi security forces in clashes around Baquba, while US and Iraqi forces intensified an offensive in a rebel-infested city that the Americans subdued last year - only to have the Iraqis lose control."

God bless you Yvonne, $200 is far from paltry. Just think if everyone gave only $20, that would add up. Not insinuating anything, was just asking. Thanks again. Now go back to your "critiquing", maybe that is a more suitable word so I won't get your feathers ruffled.

Hayes, don't get CNN Intl., never watch the domestic version either.

JDR, I stated that these were liberal programs. I don't recall calling them democrat programs. So what if the epa was established under Nixon? I don't give a rat's ass who started it. The fact remains that it is an instution worshiped by the liberals and it seeks to curb any new drilling for oil. If all you liberals don't like oil products then may I suggest you simply stop using any and all products derived from it.This would not only increase the reserves and cut the cost of gas at the pumps,but it would make you guys sleep so much better! IMO of course!

Social security program- yes,it was set up to help during the depression to help the UNEMPLOYED, but it has become the lone source of income for a vast majority of our seniors who have no other source of income. The best thing that could happen to ss is for it to go belly up and move to privatization. But then,this would leave the federal government out of the loop,and we can't have that can we??? (no vote buying oppurtunities)IMO of course!

Food stamp act- citizens selling the stamps to buy whatever has little basis in reality? ha ha ha. I personally have wittnesed this form of free enterprise. And it is not uncommon. I suggest more research in this department. IMO of course!

Don't know about the pharm' industry,but if it involves a corporation making a profit,I can see where it would upset liberals.

draftee, There is a huge difference between making a profit and price gouging. Like Exxon making a $7.8 billion net profit the first quarter of the year and Shell making $6.8 billion net profit for the same time.

Yvonne, see advice in my last post about liberals and the oil companies.

Yvonnne
If draftee doesnt mind being screwed by the industries then let him be.

And if being a liberal means not liking paying out of the world prices for gas,insurance and medicine at the very same time these industries report record profits then tattoo communist across my forehead.

And draftee the last I saw most of the country was against privitization of SS which would mean to include many repub/conservatives as well but that fact hurts your attack on libs.

Hayes, I don't care what "most"of the country thinks, I was stating my opinion. I'm still allowed,right? Also stating my opinion does not mean "attack". This is a liberal ploy used to make the opinion of one seem mean and cruel. Not so!

Draftee
You are always entitled to your opinion and as most here would attest to,I least I hope, I have never suggested to anyone otherwise.

You can count on two fingers the number of times I have used this word. The other times I changed it because I knew it would cause problems and simply here I failed to censor myself and make the change. Nothing personal was meant.

And as I feel that you can choose any problem in this country and you will find both dems and repubs or liberals and conservatives knee deep in the dirt; I think going after the libs so hard and forgetting the other side is lets say convinient.
But like I said you are entitled to your opinion,heck if everyone here had the same opinion this blog would be boring. And if you dont mind being burned by the oil and pharm. industries then more power to you. But just because some us here do have an issue with it; it doesnt make us liberals or even conservatives but it does make us concerned.

Hayes, nothing was taken personal. I do mind being burned by anyone,but I also believe in the free market system. Take away the profit of any comany and you take away the incentative for doing business. What do you suggest,placing the oil and pharm'companies under government control? What would be next,the food industry? The auto industry because cars are considered a necessity?

"Choose any problem in this country and you will find liberals and conservatives knee deep in dirt". I see some merrit to this statment,but we were talking about the government entitlement programs and the liberals are chin deep in this one as where the conservatives are ankle deep. Once an entitlement program is enacted it quickly becomes a "right". As medicade,medicare,wic,food stamps,etc. has all become a "right". And to suggest a reduction in government benefits one is quickly labeled as wanting to starve children or not wanting grandma to be able to visit a dr.

I am all for helping those who cannot truly help themselves. But when I see someone pull up into a parking space at a food store in a better car that I can afford and pay for groceries with food stamps I'm thinking "what's wrong with this picture"? AND DON'T TELL ME I HAVEN'T SEEN THIS AND IT HAS NO BASIS IN REALITY!!!

One question,Hayes: how do you think these people whom I have just described vote? The liberal canidate or the conservative canidate?

I will check your answer next week as it is time for me to hit the road another week. I will return next weekend.

Also, I will agree with you that it would be boring indeed if we all agreed. We cannot all be right. LOL

Bobby D. I agree with you about President Bush.
The media (at least on Fox News) have been reporting that the states are seperate entities and the federal government does not go in with the National Guard or any military force unless asked to do so by the governor of that state. So...when did the governor of La ask the president for help? The mayor of NO asked for help and the governor refused so let's put some of the blame where it lies and stop blaming everything on president Bush. I know a lot of you will disagree with me and that's okay but I only stated what I've seen, heard and read.

"Take away the profit of any comany and you take away the incentative for doing business."

Sort-of True. I would suggest an incentative for doing business might also be to pursue one's passion - perhaps trying to put food on the table by creating something.

I think the trend for making money for the sake of making money is THE tragedy of modern humanity.

"What do you suggest,placing the oil and pharm'companies under government control?"

There needs to be a limit on rape and pillage - which is rampant in corporate america (and I can give a hundred examples - and so can you) so yes - if people can't restrain themselves ...

"What would be next,the food industry?"

Try reading "The Jungle" - OK things are sort of better now, but the corporate food industry is still not your father's farm.

"The auto industry because cars are considered a necessity?"

Well in the 1920's, the auto industry bought up the ripped out city trolley services, making cars a necessity - so sure.

"Once an entitlement program is enacted it quickly becomes a "right"." A-freaking-men to that statement!

"how do you think these people whom I have just described vote?"

My guess is they didn't vote at all.