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This country's greatness was built on public schools with teachers who had only minimal "teaching" education.

The engineers who brought us from crystal radio sets to vacuum tubs to transitors then silicon chips were not taught by members of the NEA who had sensitivity training, social agendas and mountains of educrat beauracracy to navigate.

When did those side issues become more important to teaching than the simple methods that were used prior and accomplished so much more?

David, I came to the same conclusion years ago when they started bussing students. That act alone proved to me that education was playing second fiddle to political correctness. This was long before the era of Bill Bennett. Welcome aboard.

"...when they started BUSSING students..."

"buss" - (v) touch with the lips as an expression of love
"bus" - (v) send by bus

"Bussing" is an alternative spelling when referring to "bus." "Busing" is preferred.

PS - Wouldn't it be lovely, though, if every kid got a big hug and kiss from at least one adult every day at school? Love changes things! ;)

Peace, Missy

David lets hope the rest of the folks in your camp get the message. I hope that you are checking the post as I have added a bit that may interest you:

Every family has the right to choose their child's school

THESE are troubling times for the aristos of education. Parents and pupils are being told by all sorts of experts that they should not have to accept the schools and subjects bureaucrats and teacher union leaders tell them to take.

Under the existing ideology, all schools must be uniform in what they teach, and how they teach it, because innovation might give some students an advantage, and that would be unfair to everybody else. Because all teachers are equally excellent they should be paid the same. And when that does not work, the ideologues use an alternative argument , rewarding talented teachers for working hard is not egalitarian. There is more of the same in this old-fashioned intellectual armoury. Parents are not well enough educated to know what is best for their children, so officials should make all the decisions. And if state school students cannot count or spell, the public education elite have an automatic answer , spend more money, because no matter how much is spent, it is never enough. This menu for mediocrity is all that is on offer in public education, and the people who prosper under the present system will fight hard to make sure it stays that way. Education administrators hate the idea of self-governing schools for obvious reasons , running regimented systems provides them with power. If each school were to have its own board, which oversaw a principal in charge of all aspects of school life, no state/county/city would need as many bureaucrats. Teacher union officials loathe proposals for merit-based pay and promotions because they would mean the end of the existing arrangement where they negotiate state-wide salaries and conditions and where almost all teachers at the same career stage are paid exactly the same, whether they are good, bad or indifferent. And officials and unionists fear the idea of league tables that rate each and every school, because they make it impossible to disguise the performance of the poor ones. Even worse, if parents were ever free to choose their own school, the under-performers could run out of students and have to close. Naturally, no union official would ever want any of their members inconvenienced by such a thing. And if the education unions fear reform so do the state/county/city education boards. Short of industrial action by police, there is nothing as damaging for state governments as a school strike. (it could happen here)

In private education, parents have the power of the purse , if the school does not deliver, its enrolments erode. There is absolutely no reason why all these benefits cannot apply to state schools, by allowing them to run as autonomous organisations. It is already in the power of any education administrator more interested in protecting public education than placating the teacher unions to make it happen. The second stage of the solution is to end the artificial divide between public and private education, by giving parents vouchers for the cost of each year's schooling, which they can use at any school in the county/state. Inevitably many schools would charge more than the value of the voucher and parents would have to pay additional fees. But for the millions of people now slugged with school fees, on top of the taxes they pay to support public education, this would be an improvement. The public education lobby warns a voucher system will gut the existing state system. In its present form, so it will. But for the majority of parents who are now obliged to send their kids to the nearest school to home,( or bus them all over) , what ever its failings, it would give them something that should be their's by right , a choice in their child's education.

So you see David others are saying much the same thing. What might come as a surprise is that this was not written about the school systems in NC or the US but in Australia. These folks have had it with the system just as the folks here in this country and especially in NC and G'boro. They have seen the obstacles, the hinderances and now propose to do something about it. Australia has had a very good education system in the past, as good or even in some cases superior to that I found in the US and other countries which I llved. The US had an excellant education system also and you pointed that out very well David. It is time to overhaul the sinking system before it claims any more victims. You are right on in your opinion.

You got my point,right Missy? When children becomes pawns of the politicans it is time to make a change. imo

Most of the concepts above cannot be disputed. While I'm not yet ready to "throw in the towel" ... I am ready to demand serious change.

I am really opposed to vouchers because they selfishly dump the problem on others, removing already strained resources and making it harder to correct what clearly needs wholesale changes.

To me it's fairly simple - Education, like most things - is really a LOCAL issue. Give control back to the the parents, let local businesses have an imput into the skills they're really need, and things will happen.

Start be throwing away No Child Left Behind.
Start be throwing away the Internet in the classroom.
True Year Round Schools.
A full day of classes, with meaningful intellectual and vocational subjects for all.
Head start for all.
Graduate them after 10th grade - and they should all have an understanding of calculus, speak three languages and write two languages, be able to intellegently and politely debate and be being able to recite (memorize) more than one shakespearian oratory.
Gym 5 days a week.
A good breakfast before ever school day.
Division of students according to abilities.
Mandatory homework in all classes.
Mandatory social contributions.
Male Teachers were ties, Female teachers appropriate attire.
Simple but effective uniforms for students.
Jiveness rewarded by Dishwasher duty (cause that's where they're headed anyway).
De-emphasis on interschlastic sports, including the elimination of OT in football and state championships (it's only a game, people).

Parents Decide - Jive parents rejected from the discussion. No more "My Johnny" excuses allowed.

OK - not all are thought out - but really, we can go to the moon, we can deal with this matter.

Toss these around and lemme know - I'll go to the school board and present them (really). As one, the school board will ignore me. But if a few thouand follow with similar voices, it will happen.

Actually vouchers are an excellent way to bring a bad system into reality. First thing is that they actually do gut a system which is top heavy with administration, just like the one in G'boro and many other places in the state and in the country. There is no other real way to stop the outflow of money necessary for "real education purposes" into wasted overpaid desk jockeys and bean counters, many of whom have never spent a day in the classroom and if they have in many cases were dismal failures but kept in the system by a system of unions and politics. When under a voucher system, if the school does not produce results, it loses enrollment and shuts down. Since no school wants this to happen, results will be forthcoming and children will be getting the education they deserve.
Next local authority would work as is explained in my earlier post where the principle is made accountable to a board (local ) for the expenditures and the sucess or failure of the system. If he can not create a successful system then he is fired. Just like in the real world.
Children will not be bused all over the county just to make figures jive for some jive turkey in administration.
Yes, JR, this system would also rid us of the No Child Left Behind fiasco which only resulted in throwing good money after bad.
I agree that school could be finished in 11 yrs and possible 10 as you suggest. It works in Europe and Australia.
The following 2 years have programs for those who will attend college and programs for those who will be entering the work force.
I can agree on uniforms or a strict dress code. I grew up with such and it worked well. Of course we wore uniforms (ROTC) two to three days a week also.
Teachers dressed like teachers, ties for men and appropriate dress for the ladies.
I believe that all should be enrolled in gym class. The only exemption for us was ROTC which took place of gym for at least 2 of the 3 years of high school.
9th grade was middle school. The recent changes in the local school I attended is now they have 8&9 middle school and 7th grade is dropped back to elementry school.
I see no need for year around school if instruction is properly done in the 9 or 10 months. Year around could be offered as an option up through 10th or 11th. I do believe those last 2 years of the specialized or advanced highschool should be 12 months.
Breakfast is good, but you can't force kids to eat. Many do not like to eat early and therefor it creates a lot of waste which means a lot of wasted money which could be used else where.
Computers are to be used for computer classes not history, english, math and science.
Teach kids how to read, and yes JR, I agree with you on the Shakespere, Man I still remember much of mine.
Writing of essays should be made a top priority also. Kids can't write. Neither can teachers hahah.
Advanced classes for those who qualify and regular classes for those who don't.
For slow learners, special classes, not mainstreamed, until they can catch up.
Yes, home work is not an option. Throw it at em and make em do it. The dog ate it didn't work when I was in school and it shouldn't work now.
I agree JR, no more excuses from Momma. Johnny can face his own consequences if he screws up.
Sports programs can be good if they are not given priority over academics. I can not see doing away with sports. There is much to be gained in good programs.
Teacher work days would no longer be necessary. Exception would be 2-3 days per school year for planning with the board and principal.
Holidays would be kept to a minimum. No more spring breaks of a week. Christmas holidays commence two days prior and end the day after New Years.
I could see 2 days between semesters for teacher planning and registration, simular to college.

I beleive the mandatory service should come after graduation. It can be through military as I have submitted before. 2-3 yrs active duty, 3 yrs active reserve and an additional of no less than 2 yrs in-active reserve.
Those not qualified for military service would serve in program simular to Peace Corp and would have opportunity to serve both at home and abroad.

So there you are JR, we are not that far apart on education.
I pitch mine out also , take what you want and leave the rest.

I guess it's just you and me, M R P

It would seem that way JDR but then many will raise a hue and cry but seemingly have nothing to offer as a solution.

I have made many of these assertions for years concerning our educational system even as far back as the early 70's when it seems that the system begin it long flush down the toilet of political correctness .