News-Record.com

Rick,
One word for you: AMEN!

Okay, Okay! I can't leave it at one word!

Here's a great story of our government spending money to "spin" the truth.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15489645/

Only wish Mr. Produce would come back with his dismissing of all things obvious. LOL! In fact, we could save money by letting Dan, neocon, and others just run the department of lies and untruths. Uncle Rummy just can't stand it when the truth makes him look so pitiful.

This LTTE writer poses some very poignant and valid questions. I am in agreement with those.

Shalom

I am willing to ask the troops which kind of "support" they would like. Are you?

Mr. Reitzug's two mentioned interpretations of "supporting our troops" both revolve less around the troops themselves than whether or not one supports currently ongoing foreign policy.

I don't see it that way.

My support for the troops has nothing whatsoever to do their involvement in what I consider to be a poorly advised war, but is based on an admiration and appreciative respect for their voluntary willingness to serve our nation at the risk of their own lives during a very volatile time in world affairs.

By my way of thinking the very fact that they take those risks puts them in a position far above that of being mere representatives of the miscalculations of our elected leaders, and places their service and sacrifice among the level of man's highest dedication to his fellow man.

My support for the men and women of the United States Military is not contingent upon where they are sent, who sends them, or what their mission will be on arrival, but is earned by the fact that they have volunteered to be available wherever they are needed.

For that reason I consider them to be defending our freedoms even when they find themselves enforcing policies I personally disagree with or don't see the relevance of.

Mick,

I concur. However, I'm guessing the real answer would be neither. Both scenarios listed basically define 'support our troops' as different methods of lip service, not actively doing something to support our troops.

Actually supporting the troops could involve anything from sending packages and encouragement to them while on the battlefield, supporting their families at home or any number of possibilities.

....including prayer.

I agree with the lte. It is a question I often think when I see the stickers. Since I don't have a sticker, does anyone who has one want to explain their support?

I'm with Jan .. most in the service are doing one heck of a public service.

I'm prob' alone in saying most people with "Support Our Troops" on their cars probably are a bit clueless as to what that could really mean - just an empty slogan that some infer as "Support Our Prez'".

Even our Prez' is flip-floppin on the "stay the course" rhetoric .. he & Rove are nasty in their camapign words for the Dem's running to fill Rep'-held office and the Rep's are running away the Prez' flip-floppin rhetoric. So all that we hear is political BS.

Unfortunately, we can't bring our troops home now. We need a way to declare Victory - legit' ot BS - anything but leaving before the mission is accomplished - a credibly way to refute the pending chants of "we drove out the US".

Now Serving Free Crow to those needing to eat some.

You wanna support our troups? Get 'em a job when they get home. That means factory's and - Wait - most have gone overseas. Damm.

You wanna support our troups? Get 'em some help. I read this morning that 1-in-4 returning has filed a claim for military disability. Yesterday there was a news article and staggering stat's on the returning who are homeless, marraiges that are stained by war-altered personalities and other returning issues.

OK - I'm wound.

"Get 'em a job when they get home."

THAT'S the spirit!

Been there, done that, agree totally.

You want to “Support the Troops”? Remember that all the people serving are volunteers, the vast majority since the war started. Some are on their second or subsequent tour which tells me a percentage of them have re-enlisted. Anyone who joins the military should expect to:

1. Go to war.
2. Die for your Country.
3. See 1.

If you don’t do #1 then chances are you won’t do #2. If you do #1 and not #2, you’re a living hero. If you do #1 and #2 you’re a dead hero. If you join the military and refuse to do #1; you’re a coward and should be in prison. If you do #2 and not #1, you’re still a hero. Of course this only refers to military members that serve honorably. “Support the Troops”, next time you see one tell him/her Thanks.

Here's a simple question for you Rick: Why does those yellow ribbons upset you so? What's the problem with people displaying them?

I got one of those ribbons by making a donation to the VFW. So I suppose I was supporting troops of past wars. It got ripped off and the paint scratched while I was in a shopping center one day.

WAJ,

I'm still potty-training one of my kids. If I could get him to do #1 and #2, I'd be a hero (to my wife anyway).

In the potty, that is. The kid has no problem with doing it in the diaper.

Nitpicker,

lol, thank you. All kids are hero's to me...

Speaking of the troops, Kerry really stepped in it yesterday.

"You know, education, if you make the most of it, you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. And if you don't, you get stuck in Iraq." JFK...meaning John Forbes Kerry.

Now there is support for the troops from a leading Democrat. If you don't do your homework and end up being stupid then you will end up in the military.

That quote surpasses Kerrys voting for the 87 billion before he voted against it quote by leaps and bounds.

Here is another good one:

"Charlie (Rangel D-NY) has said there's not a single one of the Bush tax cuts he thinks should be extended. And he could achieve that objective simply by not acting. Unless there's an affirmative action by Congress, legislation passed to keep those rates low, those rates are going back up, and he'd have a massive tax increase"

In Tuesday editions of The New York Post, Rangel suggested Cheney needs professional treatment.

"He's such a real son of a bitch, he just enjoys a confrontation," Rangel said, describing himself to the newspaper as "warm and personable." He told the newspaper Cheney may need to go to "rehab" for "whatever personality deficit he may have suffered."

"When you have those sorts of problems, you're supposed to seek help," Rangel said. "He acknowledged that he has problems with communication."

While there might be some truth in Kerry's statement, it was not PC for sure.

Yeah, that Dick Cheney is a real hero. How anyone can idolize any of our current leaders, Rush, or Bill is amazing to me.

Forgot to mention, the first quote is from VP Cheney.

So Carol, you are in the camp that believes members of our military are a bunch of flunkies who couldn't get through school and joined the military because they are too stupid to do anything else?

Anyone notice that the letters to the editor didn't get put up until 10:30? Somebody's asleep at the switch at the N&R.

Rick, This is your neighbor--knowing how respectful and thoughtful you are, I am most appreciative of your lettr.I have worked with combat vets for years etc. Although admiration and respect are truly good attitudes and prayer, which as far as I know doesn't stop bullets, is also a good---if we are to answer your question, we have got to get in action, or get into motion > I don't have a blue print for what people need to do, everyone has to decide for themselves. I have, with a small group of combat vets, given professional and community presentations on "The Traumatogenic Effects Of War On The Psyche Of Soldiers On The Field Of Combat". This is a non political presentation that addresses from a soldier's perspective what he or she experiences and is exposed to while they are trying to survive in a cauldron of slaughter. We can, most of us anyway, talk about war in an intellectual way, but to hear first hand about soldiers' harrowing, life threatening war experiences along with their difficulties in re-entry will hopefully take this letter writer's inferred message to the next plane. My effort is to have people pay more attention when the talk of war is in the air and to look for alternatives; my effort is to look at the ongoing "cost" of war and re-evaluate what we are doing not only to our country but to other countries involved or impacted as well. War is more than an exercise of power. Life, Blood, Families, communities are all involved. That's how I try to support our troops--I want to bring them home as soon as possible. I never make disparaging remarks about the military. If I have issues, I bring them to the higher authorities and keep the military separate from my questioning. I'm looking always for forums to present--pro-bono-- I feel that there has to be other ways to problem solve and this is my way to press the point.

Dan,
Thanks for all the laughs! Can you say "NINE deferments"? Yep! That's that wacky, "support our troops" VP. He said he had better things to do....oh that's right, John Kerry ACTUALLY served in Vietnam and was awarded the bronze star and Purple Heart.....

Dan, how much military service do you have in your background?

Even those who would remind us dummies of John Kerry's military service won't say that he served honorably. Nominating yourself for a decoration is not honorable. Nor is the way he treated his comrades when he testified before Congress that he had witnessed atrocities by U.S. military personell. The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth had it right.

And before you ask me, 6 years total service. 4 years active duty, 2 years inactive reserve. Volunteer.

Remind me again, which frat did you serve in during the war world traveler? Your hero, Mr. Heinz, sounds like you when it comes to desecrating those who are in the military.

Kerry served in 'Nam? Oh yeah, I do remember him saying that only once in '04.

At least Kerry didn't serve as prez and the Breck Girl Edwards as VP.

BTW, DD what does someone serving or not have to do with expressing an opinion? I've made it clear in past posts that I did not serve in the military. Tell us about your military experience please, we can't wait to hear about it.

Dan, the remark was not wise. What was he thinking???

As I said before, there are some in the military because they had no better options. There are some in the military who have not served honorably. Not all who are in the military are heros. Some believe they are fighting for American freedom. It really bothers me to hear over and over how our soldiers in Iraq are dying for my freedom. By now, it should be obvious that they are dying because of poor choices (going to Iraq in the first place and having no plan and having insufficient armour and on and on)

As Joe said, the costs of war are high. The of loss of life, limb, home, family, and mental health do not seem to matter to our leaders. It is criminal what our country has done. It is not patriotic.

And again back to spin, how do you take a man who served in Vietnam and came home and said he did not support the war into a villan, and make men who managed to stay out of the war through dubvious means into patriots????? Again I say I do not blame anyone who stayed out of Vietnam by any means. Also the demeaning Republican phrase "flip/flop" should mean that a person makes a mistake, discovers that mistake, and tries to correct it. I would think it is time for this administration to make a flip/flop.

I guess being a soldier means that you do what you are told to do no matter what that order might be. In that case, the leaders who gave the horrific orders are entirely to blame.

"They told stories that, at times, they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Ghengis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam, in addition to the normal ravage of war and the normal and very particular ravaging which is done by the applied bombing power of this country." - John Forbes Kerry, April 22, 1971

BTW, Kerry also said our troops were terrorizing Iraqi women and children in the dark of night.

This guy didn't serve honorably and still doesn't. What a disgrace.

Piss all you want about "facts is facts" - 'cause they ain't, and here's what your fact minded market based leadership has fermented (not yet confirmed):

"Sunni insurgents have cut the roads linking the city [of Bagdhad] to the rest of Iraq. The country is being partitioned as militiamen fight bloody battles for control of towns and villages north and south of the capital.

As American and British political leaders argue over responsibility for the crisis in Iraq, the country has taken another lurch towards disintegration.

Well-armed Sunni tribes now largely surround Baghdad and are fighting Shia militias to complete the encirclement.

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article1945769.ece

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2430809,00.html

my guess is the unconfirmed report above was this:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2430809,00.html

Apparenly this stuff doesn't even make the news any more.

JDR, pleeeze. Don't you know that Virginia Fox went to Iraq and came back and said it is going great??? Don't you listen to the White House? Things are going great in Iraq. Don't let all those deaths and things like facts get in your way.

Dan, FACT: Kerry IS a Vietnam Veteran, he was decorated. Our soldiers did commit horrible deeds in Vietnam. Remember? I guess not since you were a kid or not even born at the time.

It was another war without justification; it was another war where our young men were sent to slaughter and be slaughtered. I never thought I would see the likes again. I was wrong.

I know a vietnam vet and he once told me of having to kill dogs there. However, he absolutely no fun in doing it. It still bothers him to this day. It was necessary under the circumstances to keep the dogs from going wild and running in packs, starving, etc. Unfortunately, it was part of war. To criticize soldiers for things they had to do is pretty low.

Amen Carol! Last year or year before I posted several stories told by my brother, another Viet Nam vet, and a co-worker, also a Nam vet, about the atrocities committed by some of our soldiers during that war. Mr. Produce took me to task in this forum and in private, telling me how the stories were not true. I concede the co-worker was mentally scarred by that war and may have embellished the rapes and murders. But I believe my brother over anyone who could not have been everywhere to declare all those stories were lies.

Dan seems to be one of those men who cannot admit making a mistake. In that respect, he and Bush share a trait. So don't expect him to even consider there are two sides to every issue.

Bush has been the number one disrespecter of our troops. As one who was not willing to fight for our country, in fact, went AWOL so he wouldn't have to, he had no moral right to sent our troops into a God-forsaken, personal war. One should never demand someone else do something one is not willing to do themself. Bush gives lipservice to our troops, little else.

Rick,
I just found the news & record on the web. I am from the Greensboro area and I wanted to keep up with what's going on in the big G!!!I am currently in Kuwait/Iraq on active duty. I am a military man that was recalled. I have 12 years active and 11 1/2 years Navy Reserves. I have been called back active before. Do you remember 9/11? Or has that started to slip our minds. Few facts for you. Less than 1% serve in our military. I am happy to say that I am one of those people. I chose to defend my country from both foreign and domestic threats. To follow the orders of the officers appointed over me. Which the top officer over me happens to be the Commander in Chief (President of the US). When I signed the contract, I swore an oath to do what I was told. For if you question an order in this line of work, you or your fellow soilder die!
Now on to your comment. We serve over here in Kuwait, Baghdad, Iraq just to name a few, because we are trying to protect those that can not protect there selves. That is part of our duty which requires us to have honor, courage, and commitment. We also help people to live there lives to the fullest, by stopping the bad people from harming them. No, we dont stop them all, but a percentage is better than 0%. Of course we could sit back and talk about it. You see, what some people mean by they support us, is not necessarily that they believe in war, but that while were there and sometimes when we return, they are letting us know they care for us and our needs and want us to know that we are loved no matter what we may be doing to other human beings. You see there are people dieing over here every day, just like in the towns all across america. I dont believe in killing another human being, but its happening. I do it to protect my own life, my fellow soilder and the others that can not.
If you were in harms way, I would protect you to the death. So, how about you cut out with the comments about what is going on over here, and talk about the upcoming Thanksgiving parade, or maybe about the Rhino employees parking in the wrong spot downtown. But I tell you this, I will be back next year. And if I happen to hear someone talking about the war and start to condemn my President of the US for what we are doing over here. I will perhaps have some of that stress, and anxiety your talking about spill out onto the end of my fist. There will be quite a few of us coming back next year that will have the same feeling. We have talked quite a bit about how we would respond to someone if they started to condemn the war, or start to question our integrity. So please for all the readers out there and the writers of the comments all over the States, just let this situation we are all in, go the course and deal with it!!!

jcool---Please be safe and come home in one peace. I hear your anger; can you hear our concern for your life and the life of all the military. Most of us support the active military, I know I do. It is at the same time patriotic and morally necessary to question our leaders about a course of action which is taken "on our behalf" or "on behalf of weaker people with our military: our sons, daughters, moms and dads etc. When we question or take issue with the administration, the military is not in that mix. We--I anyway, have to separate the two--I would never question your integrity--you seem dedicated and honorable----I at the same time don't want to see you needlessly have to put your life and limb on the line.

Please don't hit us with the anger that might be understandably flowing from your fist. We are on the same team.

I would like to know the name of young person from the Navy who wrote the comment. Being a cynic, I question that this is a real soldier's comments.

If you are real, I pray that you will make it back unharmed.

Carol-I know the "young man from the Navy who wrote the comment" very well. He is a very dear friend of mine. Your question whether he is really a soldier bothers me. Why are you so cynical? Can you not see his feelings? He is an American soldier who IS fighting for you whether "it bothers you that he is fighting for your freedom" or not. This man is a very respected man in his community. He is an umpire for girls softball, he teaches Bible school at his church, he had a wonderful job, he had his own landscaping business, his wife works for the city. He is now taken away from all of the things he loves. However, he LOVES the fact that he is an American. And to defend his patriotism and the freedom of all Americans takes priority over everything in his life. Why is defending our country and freedom now considered a "poor choice". And why do you think that there are some people in the military b/c "they have no better options?" My husband is also in the Navy, and he had plenty of options (just like jcool0000). The military life is such a wonderful life. We are so fortunate to have the support of our government. Because obviously we don't get much from our fellow citizens. Our fellow citizens who can't even believe a neighbor's blog stating that he is an actual soldier.

How many here posting would actually put their life on the line for someone you don't know? I wouldn't - not that brave. That's why I thank God every day for the men and women who serve. They don't ask why, they just do. They will take that bullet, no questions asked. Has anyone here talked with a solider and asked them how they felt about the war and what people were saying back home? Have you talked to their families?

Now their intelligence is questioned?

Carol posted:
“While there might be some truth in Kerry's statement, it was not PC for sure.”
“As I said before, there are some in the military because they had no better options.”
On behalf of my husband, my father, 6 uncles, and 5 cousins (6 with college degrees)…well it’s not polite what I would like to post, but you can get the picture. No better options? What about their choice? Everyone has a choice in this country. It’s our choices in life that makes us who we are. No one forces anyone to sign up for the military; it’s a choice – an honorable choice. People have died and will die to preserve our way of life, our freedoms. I agree that not everyone in the military is an upstanding citizen; every group has a few bad apples.
Why not get on one of these websites and actually contact a solider? Why not send them a care package, or ask if there is anything their wife and kids might need? Has anyone contacted the bases in NC and seen if there were any special programs you can volunteer for or how you can help the families?
http://www.operationusocarepackage.org/site/pp.asp?c=ikLVJ7MSKvH&b=569653
https://thor.milexch.com/scs/default.aspx
http://www.usmc-mccs.org/deploy/ml/supportourtroops.cfm
Do more than run your mouth – get involved.

jcool0000 and baileyc,
You have renewed my faith in America's military. (Not that I had any doubts, it's just sooooooooooooo nice to see someone who is there FINALLY ram it down the bleeding hearts' throat)
STANDING AND APPLAUDING!!!!!!

Thanks for your service!

Thanks for the info, Bailey. I always question posts that carry only a handle.

Laura, as you say, we all make choices. I do not demean those who choose the military. I simply do not understand their choice. I'm sure they don't understand me either.

I stayed in contact with a young Marine by email while he was in Iraq. His job was to train Iraqi soldiers, three years ago. At that time, he was very unhappy with the recruits he had to work with, told of their signing up, staying a while, then failing to return from leave. His comment was that it would take 20 years for Iraq to be able to govern themselves. He said that the main problem was that they were not fighting for their freedom, someone else was doing it. He was very loyal to the military, very patriotic, just realistic. We all thanked God when he returned home safely after a year in Iraq.

Thanks also for the links. I will check them out.

Laura,

Thanks so much for the links. Finally, a real way to support our soldiers.

jcool,

Thank you so much for your service. Know that you are in our prayers daily. When my son says his God Blesses at the end of each day, we always include you guys. You are the very definition of what a man is all about. God Bless you buddy.

I think these two have made my point and the point of many others who post here. It is a sad day for America when we see this happen to reasonable people.
God Bless the United States of America.

To jcool0000 and his buddies:

Thank you for being the 1%. We support you, but let us be clear: We all remember 9/11 but that is not why you are in Iraq. You are not in Iraq “to protect those that can not protect themselves”. You are in Iraq only because the Commander in Chief sent you there.

We are not questioning your integrity, we are not questioning your honor - we are trying to have your mission defined. Your Commander in Chief has flip-flopped several times, “Do this, no do that, no do the other thing … ” True, we do not know the daily details about “what’s going on” over there, but even the Commander in Chief concedes it is a God awful mess.

We push the Commander in Chief for a solution to the Iraq war because we want you and your buddies to complete the mission and get home safely … and that means getting the mission defined.

I really appreciated and enjoyed this particular discussion with it diversity of thought and opinions. This makes our country strong as well.
The waters here can get muddy real quick as people "support their country and each other in a variety and sometimes in almost contradictory ways". I was glad to hear from military families as they are as patriotic and supportive as their respective spouses. We live in such troubled global times; it is difficult to discern which road to take, who to support, what to voice, what to choose. I have provided psychotherapy to many a combat veteran and provided couple therapy as well---the things I heard and the stories I was told----I just can't imagine !!!! My support for the military is unyielding and steadfast but I don't always agree with decisions that come from on top---and that creates problems for me and for many of us.

I appreciate the information about jcool0000. I get a good feel for his commitment to his country, I was just a little concerned about what I interpreted to be some powerful anger that might come at the end of a fist. If I further understand him, we have got to be able to talk about what's going on, no matter who is coming home next year. I don't hear a person in this blog(?) who isn't supportive of our armed forces and their families and many of us are actively involved in supportive activities.

Finally, when I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands.....Part of that allegiance is the moral responsibility to question our leaders when they make decisions that put our soldiers in harm's way, decisions that could and do result in the loss of life, limb and blood. That questioning is both patriotic and supportive as I don't want American blood or anyone's blood spilled needlessly. That's the part of the patriotic contradiction that I was alluding to earlier. I hope taht what I've said here is helpful.

JoeJoe

James,
Thank you. If I had said that, I would have been lambasted by the right wing "working class hero" crowd. You speak my mind, as Darryl would say.
I basically intimated the same, but couldn't put it in black and white lest I have my patriotism attacked by some pretty scary folk.
Thanks again! You too, JoeJoe.

jcool0000 et al, I'm sure it's heartening for you to hear how much disdain is harbored here by the holier than thou Jane Fonda wannabees when it comes to the military. Those who are criticizing your efforts for the most part spent their youth in frat houses blowing pot on daddy's nickle.

But remember... they "support the troops"...

JDR wrote:
"Thank you for being the 1%. We support you, but let us be clear: We all remember 9/11 but that is not why you are in Iraq. You are not in Iraq “to protect those that can not protect themselves”. You are in Iraq only because the Commander in Chief sent you there."

You exhibit a basic failure to understand the Global War On Terror. Key word here: GLOBAL.
You haven't a clue, and lack the basic understanding required to participate in an intelligent conversation about the issue.
I suggest you leave and go someplace where you can bash Bush with your inane, rehearsed diatribe that doesn't necessitate use of your brain.
Say goodbye to the adults, JDR.

Whatever, Mr. Ackbar. I don't know you from blue but I do not recall you posting a single original word or shared productive link.

I think this guy has is right:

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/middle_east/july-dec06/troops_11-01.html

Even Billy Kristol agrees, but he seems to be calling for a draft " .. from its current 500,000. We would urge an immediate expansion toward a 750,000-person Army."

http://www.theweeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/012/734nyaea.asp?pg=1

... But I do Hate Kristol - he not only is a main reason we are in the Iraq Debacle, he took down a sane health-care initiative soley because it had a blue stamp on it, and it has been replaced by an insane health-care program with a red stamp.

==

... and Neo, just like you, I bought my own pot.

BTW, Ackbar .. in today's 6-men crew, I have working a just-discharged Marine recently back from duty in Iraq. What are you doing?

Since baileyc states she knows jcool10000, I want to address my question to her. Prior to going to Iraq, was this man filled with the same rage and urge to control what others think and say as he is now? Or has this "ready to knock your lights out" attitude if anyone says something negative about "his" president developed since his stent in Iraq began?

Yvonne, That's an important question. Your question is not a knock against the soldier but one that probably touches his heart as it does ours. As we have seen in this whole column, patriotism is not easy to spell out nor it is always easily accomplished. I have some of my own speculations about an answer to your question and I could find almost any explanation understandable--we are all participating differently and will have different experiences and feelings. For this particular soldier, patriotism meant, at least for a time, he has to "leave all". I wouldn't like that either. But if that's what he is feeling(??), then maybe he could say that too. But like you, I am concerned about his anger--for him and others.

I hope that we can stay on this issue a little bit longer because I have never had such an intense, meaningful and important discussion like this in a while. Will the family and friends of soldiers who participated in this column stay on board as well. I would like us all to know what impacts (day to day) the war and your loved ones' absences mean to you and to us.

Thanks, JDR, you've just shown your unbelievable ignorance once again. All of the words in my post were original. Are you saying my comments are plagiarism?
You don't understand the war on terror, how it's fought, why it's fought, or what needs to be done. You begin from that flawed basis and stumble on down the road of misunderstanding and incomprehension about the issue. Then you stand and disparage and attack those that disagree with you.
In earlier times they'd dress you in a costume with bells on your hat and little pointed shoes and point and laugh at you in the town square.

"All of the words in my post were original."

Wow - you did not invent a new language.

You said absolutley nothing except I "exhibit a basic failure to understand the Global War On Terror", followed by insults, which were not not original; I've been called much worse.

How do you calculate I have no clue about GLOBAL Terrorism? What makes you such an expert on GLOBAL Terrorism? Show what you are talking about or shut up. I do confess to not working for al-Quada so building an IED is beyond my expertise.

"Are you saying my comments are plagiarism?"

Of course not, but "You don't understand the war on terror .. " is an empty statement of opinion. What is your basis for that statement?

I post data as the basis my conclusions, and sometimes I post data that counters the conclusions of others.
On issues where there are two legit' interpertations, I often agree to disagree.
I call fools fools.

I do disparage those that express opinions only, 'cause unless it's a 45 year old hottie that expressing her opinion that she wants to have lusty sex with me, I have no interest in mere opinions.

AMEN to you James!

"Cackbar" sounds like Mr.Produce with his "expert" opinions.

naaa, big difference,

James,

You got something against 44 year old hotties? :)

Let me just say, "I'd LIKE to have something against a 45 yr old hottie".

When I requested that we stay on this topic, I wasn't looking for the above several letters.
Any one want to get back on topic or have we run the course? Again, Rick, thanks for your original letter.

Joe

“I do disparage those that express opinions only”

Really JDR? Can I ask how exactly you disparage those with opinions only? This is the second time I have seen you “disparage” another who expressed an opinion that differed from yours, however I do not seeing you doing that to those that agree with you. For example a little way up from your post Yvonne states: “Women are especially speaking out about what is important to them. They are not being sidetracked by the strawmen the GOP keeps trying to build. Iraq is the number one issue for women, dems and repubs alike, and they are not happy with the way repubs have handled our involvement. And they are less likely to vote party line just to support a particular party. Posted by: Yvonne at November 2, 2006 06:12 AM” . No where do I see you ask for any links to back up the opinion stated as fact that “Iraq is the number one issue for women, dems and repubs alike And they are less likely to vote party line just to support a particular party” why is that do you suppose? Last time I checked I was a woman and quite frankly Iraq is not the number one issue for me nor will Iraq cause me to vote against party line. And quite frankly most of my female friends feel the same way. So I waited a day to see you “disparage” Yvonne’s opinion only but you haven’t. I was curious as to why.

Oh and before I am "disparaged" and then told I need anger management, I am asking a simple question. No anger behind it, just would like to know your answer. Thanks in advance

You're right, Trish.

I only trounce on opinions-only that are far enough removed from mine that they stress my belief system.

Perhaps if another's opinion-only lines up with my unique combination of life experiences, then it makes enough sense and I do not disparage it.

If however, someone were to claim the acceleration of gravity was 1.78 ft/sec^2, I would disparage it until they respounded, "Hey I'm from the mini-planet Pluto."

That's a joke.

But assuming it wasn't a joke, we'd agree to disagree. Where they're coming from it's 1.78 ft/sec^2; for me it's a firm 32.174 ft/sec^2. We'd then meet for dinner and discuss the unrightousness derating Pluto just experienced.

As soon as I read Trish's post to Nit, I wondered how long it would be before she targeted me in some way. I knew she would; I also knew it wouldn't be long.

For her and all the rest of you: I heard it on NPR. I did not read it on the internet or in an article. Thus no links.

And I would like to remind Trish she is only one woman. This poll was done with many women across the country. Collectively, Iraq was their number one concern. The newscaster on NPR was the one reporting that those who did the poll pointed out the way in which women voted that differed from the way men voted. Women were less likely to vote a party line.

I may be an objectional person to some but I do not lie or misrepresent the truth, even when it might be to my advantage to do so.

... don't worry Yvonne, I know you're from Venus.

"As soon as I read Trish's post to Nit, I wondered how long it would be before she targeted me in some way. I knew she would;"

Yvonne would you mind getting off your high horse, taking your nose out of the air and getting over yourself. (Now that was an attack, do you see the difference?). Let me make a couple of things clear, you are not that important of a person in my book, that being said I ignore you, have you noticed that? I don't even read your post, I used yours as an example as it was the first I came to. Secondly I didn't attack anyone, I asked James a question do you know the difference between the two or do I need to post the definitions? Third I could have pulled out any "opinion" from a number of sources on this blog, Carol, DD, OR EVEN Darryl to ask my question to JAMES (NOT YOU). This had nothing to do with you. Why must you always attack me? I don't even address you yet your first sentence is slamming me. I haven't posted to you in years and try to avoid you. As a matter of fact if I was so bent on attacking you at every turn would have done it a week or so ago when I said hello to nitpicker. Heck would have done it many of times when I read the blogs, which I do everyday by the way. However as I said although you like to ride high up on that horse, you really aren't that important of a person. If I didn't know any better I would think you were jealous you aren't getting any attention from me. Always have to be in the spotlight huh? For the record I would appreciate it if you ignored me as I do you. I really don't want anything to do with you hence which the one of the reasons I quit posting at the blogs to begin with.

So JDR I wanted to say I'm sure you might think my above post might should get the statement of "have you thought of anger managment classes". So I thought I would head you off at the pass. I am not angry, because "she whose name shall not be mentioned" is not important enough to get angry over. Just stating my case as I always have to defend myself against her slurs.

By the way, thank you for giving me an honest answer. I was just curious. Read something nit wrote awhile back about people taking up for those on their "side" as oppossed to the other side. (By the way that is a paraphase I don't have time to find the direct quote). Anyways since then it had me thinking and observing.

"I wondered how long it would be before she targeted me in some way. I knew she would; I also knew it wouldn't be long"

Oh my gosh, I am sorry to disappoint. I so know how you are like the Queen Bee around her and how the N & R blogs revolve around you but it looks like I was remiss in my duties. You see I posted my post to James before nit.

My post to JDR: Posted by: Trish at November 3, 2006 09:59 AM

and my post to nit: "Posted by: Trish at November 3, 2006 11:00 AM"

How disappointing to you, to not have a clue as to why you are attacking me huh? I mean really how dare I try to have a conversation that doesn't involve you. Aww well, I know you just can't stand it to have me ignore you, so I thought I would give you the attention you seem to crave. There is it all better now? That spotlight bright enough for you? Or do you want me to acknowledge you in some other threads to? It been so long I totally forgot that the world revolves around you, you being such an important person and all.

ps: Do you remember way back when you promised like 5 times never to speak with me again, would you mind actually keeping that promise this time?

"I heard it on NPR. I did not read it on the internet or in an article. Thus no links"

How very convenient for you. However why should we believe you, why isn’t Carol questioning you, like she did the solider, why are you so special as to get a pass? I guess if neo used that line it would be believed also huh?

Gosh, it is fun playing the devil I am made out to be. Hope you are enjoying it as much as I am. Just let me know when you have received enough of my attention. K?

"I knew she would; I also knew it wouldn't be long"

Oh my gosh, I didn't realize you thought about me so much. Well I guess I need to apologize then because you see, I actually posted in the blogs a couple of weeks ago. I actually had a conversation with 2 people and not once did I hunt you down and attack. What a suprise that didn't happen. Oh and here are the links just in case you don't believe me.

http://blog.news-record.com/staff/letters/archives/2006/10/if_economys_so.html#comments

http://blog.news-record.com/staff/letters/archives/2006/10/our_financial_p.html#comments

I guess the devil wasn't with me those days. Well do you think you've had enough attention yet? I hope so because as much fun as this is, I do have more important things I need to do. I know you will miss me but I hope these past post directed towards you tides you over until the next time. And have no fear, now that I know you want my attention I will be sure to stop in and say hello to you also.

ps: I know I am not as good as that other poster who use to follow be around letter from letter attacking me (what was his name satan?) and writing obsencene things about my kids, family and me, but I hope you have enjoyed this as much as you did the "momma" jokes that was directed toward me and my family. You do remember how you "liked it and thought it was funny and nice to have a bit of jokes". Haha That's the reason you lost all respect from me and I don't even bother to read your post.

Trish - please take this as constructive critism.

I think some (much) of the way you come across is simply a "style" issue, but it does come across as really-in-your-face, like when someone says "OH YEA, WELL ..."

My sense is you are a really bright person, seriously underemployed and rarely in an situation that lets you relax a bit, catch your breath, etc.

Again as constructive critism ... if you could occassionally - simply take some deep breaths, and let them out slow ... perhaps while driving to work or what ever, you will be glad you did.

I say this from personal experience, 'cause I sure need to do it occassionally too!

Anyway, have a good week end, and take it slower, babe.

TRISH - 10

Libs - 0

Here's my $0.02 on the Iraqi situation being the # 1 issue to women. This is pure BS. I have no doubt Iraq is the #1 issue to LIBERAL women who think (hope) it will bring about the downfall of the republicans,(ie Yvonne, Carol Dunn - honorable mention to Darryl) but as far as being the #1 issue... pure cow manure. As for my wife, 2 daughters, and the couple of female co-workers who discuss these matters, Iraq isn't even on their radar screen.

Good to see Trish cleaning clocks again. You go girl.

I question those who do not have Iraq on their radar screen. To the informed, Iraq should be uppermost in our minds and hearts. Many people are dying every day, Americans and Iraqis. Billions of dollars are being spent from borrowed money. What is more important than this?

Trish, I said and I repeat. Anyone can post a comment. When a name is not used, just a handle, I question the contents of the comments about personal experience. Don't you?

"Trish, I said and I repeat. Anyone can post a comment. When a name is not used, just a handle, I question the contents of the comments about personal experience. Don't you?"

No I don't. I have never questioned you about whether it was true or not that you were a retired teacher, or that Yvonne was a nurse, JDR an engineer, Daryll about being a Quaker, Dan about owning his own business or even Jan about being an eldery person. Why should I? I mean if you aren't telling the truth to begin with, why would I trust you to tell the truth if questioned?

Now if I was on a dating site, that is a totally different situation! LOL

"My sense is you are a really bright person, seriously underemployed and rarely in an situation that lets you relax a bit, catch your breath, etc."

Thank you JDR, but I do have to laugh at this observation. I am the most laid-back, lazy person you would ever come across. I am always in situations where I relax, mostly at work and at home, heck school too during class. About the only time I don't catch my breath is when I have been a slacker and wait till the last moment to get some work done.

But I do have to say I don't mind the constructive critism, however I would be interested to know why I received it. I may not post here as much, but I do read and if there was ever a person in need of your advise, I think DD would make the perfect canidate. As a matter of fact what you wrote seems more like him then me.

I will admit I don't mean to be "in for face" so to speak and it is never intended that way, as you said I think it is mostly style and a little bit of influence from someone on this blog.

Either way, thanks for the advice. Yes today I went off but I'll be honest JDR. I'm tired of someone always making me be out to be the bad person while she herself plays the vicitim. I was only curious so asked you a question that had nothing to do with her. If I wanted to make a point about her lack of links, I would have addressed my post to her. But her butting and basically slamming me about attacking her when I didn't, well yeah I can see where you might read those post and think I need to relax. But for the record, I was having a good time with them. I better stop rambling before I get called to the carpet for my too long post!

Hope you have a good weekend also

"Good to see Trish cleaning clocks again. You go girl."

Thanks neo. Although I don't post as much, I do still read everyday. And you always bring a smile to my face. Love your humor.

By the way I agree with you about the Iraq and women thing. Heck most women have more on there minds, like husband, kids, work, cleaning the house, what's for super etc. etc. For anyone to think that Iraq is going to change their vote is more then likely wrong. If it didn't work in 2004, why is going to work in 2006?

Oh my my!!! When my wife told me I better look on the comment I made, I would have never thought it would receive so many responses. First of all, thanks to BaileyC for the comments. I wish I was there now, I would give you a big Ric Flair walk just for you!!! Wooooooooo.
First of all, I am so glad that we all have different opinions. Thats what makes this the most wonderful place in the world. The mind and heart are able to respond in so many different ways. Secondly, when I spoke of my fist, I assure you it was meant in a way that one of our Past Presidents used his term "carrying a big stick."
I carry a M16 and 9mm with me almost everywhere I go, well actually everywhere I go. So, dont worry about me being a man that would use my fist for damage except to defend myself.
I dont care to play the battle of the wits with each person who wants to feel a certain way. I just know that from my heart, each time I see the flag of the United States or hear the National Anthem, I feel an emotion come over me that causes the tear ducts, and throat restraints. It makes me proud to see the flag. I have folded that flag for at least 200 veterans in ceremonies. My mind starts to think of all the people that before us layed down their life for many different causes. Our own Nation lost half a million people because of fighting for the rights to form our Nation. Was their loss of life worth it? Thats for each to decide. But if they had not fought for our forming a nation, where would we be today? What type of rights, and freedom would we have? Once again, I don't know what we would adhere to at this point in our lives, but I know that if I can help to save one of the people in any part of the world from being slaughtered, then I choose to do that. That is the decision that I made prior to the signing of my enlistment into the US Navy. Nobody held a gun or weapon to my head, or even brainwashed me into fighting. I made that decision with a clear, and sound mind and body. Matter of fact I have raised my hand, 5 times and said those sacred words that I would defend my country from both foreign and domestic.... And when I return from Iraq/Kuwait I will be completing 25 years of dedicated service to my country.
Now, as to the ones who commented, each and everyone of you, thanks for standing up for what you believe. You each have that right. Dont let anyone take that away.
I will be returning next year, and I will even post when I am returning. I can not do that at this time to put my unit at risk.I do not care to give my name at this time, only because of the safety for my wife and family. I am proud of my name. Its call OPSEC. But I tell you this, I am for real, and if your interested in meeting me for a conversation, whether you agree or do not agree, I welcome that. I am a loving, caring individual that is blessed to have many friends, many children that love me and have shown me their support through previous deployments.I know that I will be happy to be home to my wife and family and would like to hear what you have to say. Either way. I will not be hard to spot I assure you. Because the first thing I will do when I get back is go to Bruegers Bagels and have a Rosemary bagel with Jalapeno cream cheese. I will wear my uniform on that day. So lets have a bagel party!!! Stay tuned to this blog around next year or if its gone off the record, I will post one entitled Your Supported Coming Home!!! and you will know the day I plan to be at Brugers. Ok once again thanks to all of you for your support and to the ones that have a different opinion. Thats your right. I am glad we have that right.
Until then.
Jcool out!!!

jcool,

Thank you for responding and thank you for your service to our military. I was sincerely worried, after your first post, about what came across as almost a rage. Having seen what war can do to a previously healthy mind, I wept at the loss of another one. Am glad you sound more reasonable in this post.

You and your family, as well as all those involved in this war, are on my heart and in my prayers.

That is also true of some of those who express so much anger and discontentment here in this forum. I pray God will touch your heart and make you a kinder, happier person. This is a sincere concern.

jcool0000

Keep posting when you get a chance.

jcool, I love bagles but will pass on the jalapenos. If you like them, I can bring a jar of our home grown ones, guaranteed to bring the strongest to their knees.

Thank you for recognizing that we don't all have to agree. God bless and keep you.

See you next year.

I appreciate all the comments that folks have made in response to my letter, particularly those that focused on the issue(s) and did not resort to personal attacks. It's easy to slap a ribbon magnet on a car; as your discussion shows, it's much more difficult to figure out what it really means to "support our troops". Just a point of clarification for neocon: I was not a pot-smoking frat boy attending college on my daddy's dime. My dad had to support a family of 8 kids and there simply wasn't money to pay for my college education. I worked my way through college, paying for 100% of my education, graduated in 4 years, never set foot inside a frat house, and simply didn't have money for buying pot.

jcool,
I support you and your attitude! You truly are "cool"!
Thanks for your post and for setting the record straight with the neocon. That last part was for naught, as his brain contains parts that haven't moved in years!
And as Ric Flair would say, "Wooooooooo!"

"thanks for setting the record straight with the neocon"...lol

Do you take medication for your delusions world traveler?

_________________________________________________

Rick, I never called you a pot smoking frat boy. I had the world traveler in mind when I made that comment, but to all others: if the shoe fits, wear it.

Actually, if you changed the "pot-smoking" to "beer drinking", the shoe would fit our president quite well--and daddy sure had a lot of dimes to buy that beer... Ok, sorry, I digress from the issues...

Any comments about this development? I listened to the interview. Suggest you all do the same.

All Things Considered, November 4, 2006 ·

The Military Times Media Group, which publishes the influential Army Times and other military periodicals, is calling for Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld to resign. In a coming editorial, the papers say active-duty military officers have misgivings about war planning in Iraq. Robert Hodierne, senior managing editor of Army Times, speaks with Debbie Elliott.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6435503

NPR doing a hit piece on Rummy?

When can we look forward to DR interviewing this guy, just to be fair and balanced?:

http://www.discoverthenetwork.org/Articles/Mideast%20terror%20leaders%20to.html

NPR merely reported the news. The hit is coming from the military. Can't you read or comprehend?

Please read today's story of the young illegal from Peru who was snagged by Homeland Security. That is one of the most horrible and scary stories I have read in a while. Does this make you feel safer? It makes me ashamed.

My heart goes out to this young woman and her husband. They are paying the price for the "sins of the father". She was brought here by her parents and thought she had done what was legally necessary to remain in the states.

Although the article does not state, apparently she english-speaking and earns her own living. In other words, does not rely on the American taxpayer to subsidize her and her husband.

The real crime here is she has been contributing to the community and country (taxes) yet she is being treated like a free-loader. All the while hundreds of thousands of illegals are knowingly crossing the borders and being rewarded for it. It makes no sense to me.

Her parents are still fighting for political asylum while the daughter they brought here is deported. This is exactly what I would expect from the regime the parents escaped from.

Hello from Iraq. This is jcool0000 coming to you. Hope this finds everyone doing well and in a good mood. Well, I guess the news of the day for us is the death penalty for Sadaam. That could make a good debate about the death penalty.
I just received my air card, so I am now able to be online almost anywhere I go. We are very restricted with our internet here because of OPSEC, so with the air card I can access more sights. I have some habeneros for you Carol that are pretty hot. I actually crossed a jalapeno and a banana pepper this year. The banana pepper was smoking. But those habeneros would fire you up even more. I will plant some this summer when I get back. Carol and anyone else is more than welcome to have some. Had plenty this year to share with my navy buddies while we trained in Norfolk.
Well, I am 8 hours ahead of you in Greensboro. Nothing to debate today, but wanted to just talk to someone that I felt like was out there listening. Looks like you have some things going on in Greensboro. I am working on getting some kind of fund raiser going here to donate some monies for the school that burned down. Will keep you posted. If this emailing offends anyone, because of just keeping you all updated, just let me know and I will not email anymore unless we get a good topic going.
Goodnight from Iraq
jcool0000

Hey JCOOL, this is Rick here, the guy that wrote the original letter to the editor that started this conversation. I wanted you to know the immediate event that motivated my letter. I saw a photo of one of our soldiers in Iraq, kneeling next to the upright rifle of one of his buddies who had obviously just been killed. The soldier had tears in his eyes and an awful look of grief on his face. It really tore at my heart and made me think again about how difficult your lives are in Iraq and how the things you must be going through seem almost beyond the capability of human beings to endure. It also made me a bit angry at what I perceive to be the hypocrisy of people who slap a "support our troops" magnet on their car but then don't do anything to really support you (although I'm sure some with those magnets do). It seemed to me that the best way of supporting the troops was by working to get ya'll back over here, safe and sound. Please know--I am certainly not against you--although I disagree with the decisions that brought you to Iraq--and I have nothing but admiration for your tremendous courage, heroism, and selflessness. If there's anything you need over there, let me know what it is and how I can get it to you. Be well, and may God continue to keep you safe and to bless your family and loved ones. Rick

Just one clarification in my letter: when I wrote about "the decisions that brought you to Iraq", I meant "the decisions made IN WASHINGTON that brought you to Iraq". Stay cool...and safe. Rick

Rick,
I want to thank you for taking the time to let me know what you are feeling. Thats what is so great about communicating. So many points can be made about a situation that all involved will be enriched when there is discussion.I am glad that you had the feeling for someone that was greiving for a lost budd. It is a tremendous loss. There are things that go through your head that most will never comprehend.
I can understand what you are saying about slapping the sticker or magnet on the vehicle and then doing nothing.
I was reading one of the other postings about support and will put what I wrote onto this posting.
Rick, thanks so much for being an honest caring individual. Thank you for your prayers.

For those of you that are in this one, some of your names are familiar.
For Yvonne, I have two sites for you. www.anysoldier.com and www.asa-usa.org
The latter stands for America Supporting Americans.
My troops happen to be registered under the anysoldier.com. I work with army, airforce, navy and marines. We travel the dangerous roads together. I see many armed forces members each day that are traveling the dangerous roads, and anything that I receive goes to them. So you will be helping many if you sign up at one of these sites. I am a Navy man with 23 1/2 years service. I have signed my troops up for the anysoldier.com If you go to that web site and look you will see my name under Navy. The name is IC2 Joe Crews. I screen everything that is sent to us. There is to be no home baked goods, opened cd's, alcohol or drugs. The home baked goods, because of not knowing where they came from. the cd's because of viruses to our computers, the last two is easy to figure out.
Thanks to all of you for your support. Please check out the other responses from the Oct31 support the troops.
Thanks
Jcool