News-Record.com

"And at a time when thousands of local jobs have been lost to overseas rivals that have low-wage advantages, how does it improve our competitiveness to raise our labor costs still higher?"

William's right! Perhaps we are going at this all wrong. We should instead set a "maximum" wage to get our competitive advantage back. About $1.50 an hour sounds about right. Get rid of those anti-competitive child labor laws too. Environmental and safety regulations have got to go too.

Then just sit back and watch the magic of the marketplace in action.

"Who is the Minimum Wage Council that it feels qualified to dictate the terms of work for me?"

They are micro-managing, feel good liberals, Mr. James. They have soft hearts and mushy heads, this is what qualifies them to dictate to others how to run their private businesses.

I have yet to hear of any negative economic turns since the minimum wage was increased in NC by the NC Legislature. While it was not to a $9.00+ per hour increase, it was minimal at best.

I believe that Mr. Williams needs to reinvestigate (or investigate) some of the information presented. Not all minimum wage earners, "...are not the primary source of household income. They are unskilled or inexperienced teens for whose work employers cannot pay much." This is a myth propagated by those who like to squelch helping those people on the bottom of the "wage pole."

Rufus makes some valid sarcastic points as well! The only people with the wealth earnings potential after "downsizing" are those on the TOP of the "wage pole!" I have family members in furniture and formerly in textiles. The owners, CEO's, etc. of those companies have continaully had their wages increased. In the case of the furniture people, the top dogs keep getting larger and larger bonuses for sitting in an office. This happens while the ones left to do the "grunt" work in the factory are lucky to get ONE raise per year, if that!

So Mr. Williams, if you are content with your salary, fine. However, do not seek to keep others impoverished because of your contentness.

Shalom

"In the case of the furniture people, the top dogs keep getting larger and larger bonuses for sitting in an office. This happens while the ones left to do the "grunt" work in the factory are lucky to get ONE raise per year, if that!"

Little class envy Darryl hmmmm?

Chances are the ones sitting in the office went to college, worked hard and earned a degree to have a skill while the "grunt" workers did not.

Here is how it works Darryl: People are paid based upon the skills that they can offer an employer, many of those skills require an advanced education. An advanced education costs time and money, however it leads to greater salaries based upon the skills. Therefore a mechanical engineer in a factory with a masters degree will make more money than a an assembly person with a 10th grade education. Got it?

If I were an employer or potential employer in Greensboro and was mandated by law to pay every employee over 9 bucks an hour regardless of their skills I would go somewhere else.

Dan,

You and everybody else. Regardless of your opinion about minimum wage, the idea of a city like Greensboro setting it's own minimum wage is a non-starter.

No envy Dan. And most of those "top dogs" I reference do NOT know the industry in which they work. Rather, their degree is in Business Administration. Which translates into screw the little man and concern one's self with the how much money I can make the stockholders.

Call what I state anything that is desired. I know far more 10th grade educated people in certain industries who could manage/run company's/corporations FAR better than those "highly educated" do nothing people.

And now for my "cheap shot;" Dan, afraid that some 10th grade educated person will come along and do your job better and outclass you?

Shalom

Still seems envious to me Darryl. You claim that most company management don't know the industry in which they work. Can you find some stats on that? BTW, what is wrong with an education in business admin.?

When I got out of college I ended up in an unfamiliar industry. Guess what? I learned about it!!

What is wrong with making money for stockholders? That is the purpose for a public company, to make a profit and reward those who invested in the company. Many companies offer stock ownership programs for their employees (my former employer did)so employees benefit from stock ownership as well.

No worry on my part Darryl. I am a highly trained professional consultant, trainer and business owner.

Dan,

You are living in a "bygone" world if you think education is the panacea of success. In a world that no longer exists, what you said re education WAS true. Now, success can be had without an advanced degree. It depends on what price you are willing to sell your soul for, how many people you can step over on your way up and how little conscience you have.

Darryl is right about most CEOs. They do not know much about the company they run. They hire knowledgeable grunt folks who may not have had the educational opportunities they had. Those are the ones who make the company money that pays for the exorbitant salaries and bonuses of CEOS.

IMHO, you have responded to Darryl in a shoddy way. It is not he who has class envy but you who has shown himself to be a snob full of holier-than-thou judgments. There are many folks in grunt work positions who have worked harder than you ever thought about working. They just didn't have the same privileged upbringing and educational opportunities your folks provided for you. Rather than take that for granted, you should be thanking God you were not one of the unlucky ones.

Over the years you have flaunted your worldly possessions and money. And you have always taken full credit for everything you have, ie, if you can pull yourself up by your bootstraps, so can anyone else. Well, news flash Dan, you DIDN'T do it all by yourself and we all know it. Too bad you don't. Maybe it would humble you a bit.

Mighty pithy Yvonne. I remember you shooting back at folks who don't know you making judgements about you. Back at you:

"There are many folks in grunt work positions who have worked harder than you ever thought about working."

Please tell me about my work history Yvonne. Tell me about my working 12 hour days flipping burgers at McD's. Did that for 5 years. Or was it the job I had installing air conditioning duct work? Maybe it was the job cleaning tables and the kitchen at the Friendly Road Inn fish house? No, coulda been the job moving furniture from trucks into houses. Well, it coulda been my first job at 14 cleaning windows, tables and bathrooms at the Mayberry ice cream store.

Nah, I've never done grunt work Yvonne. My parents put the silver spoon in my mouth and it's still there :)

To the contrary, my parents provided for me, but they always taught me a work ethic and they did a damn good job at it. That is why I'm a success today and I'm proud of it thank you.

You don't post much anymore but you are usually quite reasonable when you do. I'll chalk this one up to having a bad day.

I respect you and we agree on certain issues, but this time you went a bit over the top with generalizations.

Dan, doesn't the wrath of these liberals just inspire the hell out of you? Don't they just make you feel like lying around on your ass all day and drawing welfare?

The ones they elect to represent them are no different, either. Pitiful.

Right on Dan.

The comments by some of the socialists on this blog are just down-right un-educated. They loathe capitalism but enjoy the spoils. They think by throwing someone elses money at all the nations problems,solves them.
Well here's a short list of their failed extortions paid for by TAX-PAYERS.
Welfare system is a joke. How does it motivate people to pay them for sitting on their asses and collecting bonuses for each child born out of wed-lock?
Schools, more money being put in now than ever and more people dropping out and failing.
Housing projects are nothing more than a safe haven for gangs, drugs,prostitution, you name it.
So now they want to help out the victims of their failed social policies and give them a fat raise for flipping burgers or the ones that hold up the lines at the express lane because they can't count change.
Here's an idea if you really want to help. Stop taxing the hell out of working American's wages.
Stop taxing every damn dime we spend and every blade of grass we own. And maybe some of the working poor who "don't want to be poor" will become more prosperous.

You need to change your appellation. It says considerably more about YOU than it says about those you are trying ... and failing ... to debase.

When crudity and/or ignorance floats up (and in the 8:06 PM post above, we see a fine example of both), it will be bludgeoned, regardless of the perspective of the purveyor.

See, James D. Rockefeller? I am an "equal opportunity" triggerman.

Oh Yvonne, I forgot my first two career jobs. 1) Inspecting asbestos removal sites. That involved stripping down naked, dressing up in a special jump suit, donning a respirator, and hanging out in crawl spaces and boiler rooms to make sure the crew removed the asbestos properly. Then we had to remove our suits and shower one after another!!! Hot water was a rarity.

2) (This is a good one) Sampling cotton dust levels in textile mills!!! That involved being there for all three shifts for several days at a time. And you know what Yvonne? I had to actually speak with, eat with, and otherwise be around textile workers!! You know....those "grunt workers". Oh the humanity!!

Damn I'll never forgive my parents for making me work.

OK Jack hows my new appellation now. I do apologize to any whom I have offended especially you Jack and your intellectual colleagues. I stand humbly corrected.You are right Jack I was starting to act like a "public-educated, News-Record subscriber.
I will now try and remove the "carbon-footprint" that I have put in my mouth.

Over-taxed
AKA JDR Sux,DD swallows and Jack drools

Dan,

No, I don't post much anymore and would not have posted on this one had your posts not been so high and mighty. I read all the jobs you held before starting your own company. They are impressive. I now know that you were once amongst those you look down on today. Where do I get the impression you feel superior to those left behind grunts? Your posts scream inferiority and superiority.

You missed the point I was trying to make. It does not make any difference if you shoveled manure years ago. You do not shovel it today but your posts indicate you think those who are shoveling it today are in that job because: 1)They are lazy. 2)Have no initiative. 3)Are satisfied with shoveling manure. 4)Have no education and are not interested in getting one.

For as long as these blogs have been online, you have presented the idea that anyone can "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" and improve their station in life just because you did. I was pointing out you got a jump start on a lot of people because of what your parents provided you financially (an expensive education for starters).

I improved my situation in life without the help of parents (because both were dead) or without a husband (because I left his abusive butt). And I had three children still at home. I relied on the government and a part-time job for my education. Thanks be to God they had a program that helped me be a student and a mother.

The difference between you and me is I KNOW not everyone can do the same. I don't blame poor people for being poor. We are all individuals with individual talents and handicaps. I don't brag about my worldly stuff, about my education or my success. I look at those less fortunate and think, but for the grace of God there go I. And I give God all the glory for all my blessings.

If you have any empathy or concern for those less fortunate than you, it does not come thru in your posts. You come across as blaming those who do not meet your standard of success. You probably are a nice guy but your posts re the poor almost always sound cold and hard-hearted.

Sure, there are lazy individuals out there who beat the system every way they can. However, not everyone who remains in a grunt worker position fits that description.

I really do not mean to sound preachy or demeaning for that is not how I feel. It is my intent to let you know how harsh you seem when you blame people for things that might be beyond their control.

The new appellation is much better, Overtaxed. It's a fine choice. Many will be able to identify with your selection.

Of course, your crudity is still present in the text of your post, but I suppose it's quite a change after a lifetime of relying upon vulgarity to put across your message. The ol' septic system can't be cleaned out overnight, eh, Overtaxed?

Too bad, really. Your posts that have had merit were simply negated by your choice of words.

Nice reply Yvonne. You are the exact person I am talking about. Your parents deceased, your husband MIA, YOU, Yvonne, YOU decided to get an education and do something with your life.

You of all people should be preaching my message of how to be successful. You should be proud of it and let others know it. There is nothing wrong with being proud of an accomplishment.

I was fortunate to have parents who do what parents should do, raise their kids provide them an education, teach them values including a work ethic. Now that I have my own kids I realize and appreciate even more the sacrifices they made for me and my four siblings.

Even so, my parents paid for my basic needs, not much more. I got a job at 14 and have worked ever since. My parents never bought me a car and other luxuries that are taken for granted today.

You were not that fortunate, but you took it upon yourself and made it. I congratulate you on your accomplishments. BTW, your use of govt. aid is how it should be used, temporary assistance while learning skills to become employable and then no longer need govt. aid.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem to express a bit of disdain for me because I had parents around to help me.

As for others you mention who are poor, I still think anyone who has the physical and mental abilities can succeed in life if they put in the effort.

You should be inspiring folks to do this rather than allocating them to a life of gloom and despair.

Here is an inspiring story:

http://www.greatharvest.com/

From the homepage, click on "Meet Nido Quebin" in the top right hand corner.

As for empathy and concern for others. I served 9 years as a "Big Brother" for a young fatherless black child. He grew up and now works on communications equipment on Navy ships. I'd like to think my time with him contributed to his success.

I've worked at Bell House with handicapped folks. I give to charities and my church. I even leave the housekeepers tips when I stay in a hotel room.

Most of all, I try to treat all people with respect.

What I don't do is put up with people who are too lazy to go out and make something with their lives and depend on the govt. in perpetuity.

Try some inspiration Yvonne. Honey is sweeter than vinegar.

Dan,

I say, with all sincerity, I am happy you are blessed with such good parents and that you still have them. After all, just because I am a few pounds over my ideal weight does not mean I can't rejoice with those who are able to shed a few pounds. I believe jealousy is a wasted emotion. Besides, I love happy people so I could not have disdain for you personally.

It is true that your attitude re the poor upsets me at times. Care and concern for those less fortunate is not a one day, one time, one year deal. It is ongoing. Being upset because some grunt worker may make a mere nine bucks per hour is not, imho, showing any care or concern for that person or their circumstance. And to add insult to injury, blaming them for staying a grunt worker (and poor) is like blaming a woman for getting raped. That "It's their/her fault attitude" is what I have issue with.

Like you, I had good parents and never knew what it was like to struggle until I was twelve. My dad owned a couple of businesses and provided well for us. Then my mother died and my dad had to sell off his businesses to pay for my mother's medical expenses. (She was sick a long time and went to some expensive hospitals because she did not want to die and leave four young children motherless. But that is what she did do---at the ripe old age of 33.)

Although I am now 61, I remember well what it was like to be privileged and then poor. And I know not everyone has the drive, determination or ability to overcome their situation in life. It is not a matter of condemning anyone to accept their "bad" luck to acknowledge that not all people are the same.

It reminds me of what a wise counselor said about unfulfilled potential. She said it's not worth horse s--t. If it's never realized it's worthless. She also said what could have been, was. If it could have been any different, it would have been. She was speaking of relationships at the time but I find both gems of wisdom.

In application to the topic, if people have the potential to climb from the bottom of the ladder, they usually do. If they don't, it's usually because they can't for one reason or another. That is what I believe. And while I know there are exceptions to every rule, I cannot believe most people stay in a situation which hampers their ability to make money because they want to.

I guess we will have agree to disagree on this issue as I do not see myself ever believing people want to be poor.

Much more honey Yvonne, thank you.

I'm sorry my attitude upsets you sometimes. I simply believe a local govt. forcing employers to pay people over $9/hr. regardless of skills is misguided.

It has nothing to do with looking down on lower income folks, I don't like govt. fiat that raises the costs of products/services for everyone. Keep in mind these folks may earn more, but someone has to pay for the increased labor costs: you, me AND these folks now being paid $9.36/hr.

"And I know not everyone has the drive, determination or ability to overcome their situation in life."

That is true and I have no problem with it. Want to flip burgers the rest of your life? Fine with me, I can respect that. At least you are working. Just don't sit around on your arse and expect the govt. (taxpayers) to take care of you.

Welfare exceptions: temporary assistance like you had and those who are not physically and/or mentally able to work.

You of all people Yvonne should serve as an inspiration to others and should preach that message. You overcame the loss of a parent, loss of income and a divorce. Despite all of these obstacles you prevailed and became a professional nurse.

You could have sat around on welfare, but you wanted to make something of your life instead. THAT is the message. I truly applaud people like you and hope you will inspire others to do the same.