America should honor treaty against torture
When Mark Bowden defended waterboarding (column, Jan. 6), essentially arguing that it is ethical to do evil to achieve a possible good, I was left wondering whether we as Americans consider it moral to disown our commitments.
The United States ratified the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which states that "no one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment."
We ratified the Geneva Conventions, which prohibit "torture … and humiliating and degrading treatment."
We ratified the Convention against Torture, which declares that "no exceptional circumstances whatsoever … may be invoked as a justification of torture."
Bowden suggests that waterboarding is not torture "in the traditional sense of inflicting pain." That is not a "traditional" definition. In the U.S.-supported Convention against Torture, torture is defined as "any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental," is inflicted to secure information. Waterboarding certainly fits. And if it didn't, what about our pledge to avoid "cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment"?
Bowden acknowledges that those who engaged in waterboarding were breaking the law; he just says it's OK to ignore law and treaty. We've pledged to the world to uphold certain universal moral precepts. We need to honor our pledge.
Leon Spencer
Greensboro
Comments (10)
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The commander-in-chief sets the tone for our nation. When that highest ranking elected official has such disregard for laws and agreements of our nation, it is little wonder that other citizens think it is OK to break our laws also. Then those same citizens want to whine when others (non-citizens) break our nation's laws. If we have so little respect and disregard for our agreements and laws, why should anyone else respect or obey those same agreements and laws?
Again, the attitude and arrogance of GWB is permeating and ruining our country. He is now trying to coerce (bully) our allies into attacking Iran. The man has a Hitler complex. It is no wonder America has lost it's standing as a superpower and the respect of the world.
Posted on January 14, 2008 6:09 AM
Yea, lets not water board, we should behead people, I have yet to see a lte are a liberal tabloid complain about this. Yvonne I like to see some proof of your above statement. When you make a charge this serious you should be able to back it up. I not a Bush fan by no means, but this is ludicrous in my opinion. I think we should do what ever it takes to protect our country. Also I do not whine, I speak clearly, round these ILLEGALS up and send them home. Would I be correct to think your hate of Bush is greater than your love for your country.
Posted on January 14, 2008 7:35 AM
Mr. Spencer, while you state, "Waterboarding certainly fits." that is a personal opinion, not a legal declaration. Unless somehow you have been anointed to declare what is legal or not in our world. I don't think you have.
Posted on January 14, 2008 9:01 AM
Dog:
Yeah! That's telling 'em! Let's become just like them! That's REAL smart.
-----------
"Cackbar"
Where are your credentials?
Posted on January 14, 2008 10:47 AM
"Would I be correct to think your hate of Bush is greater than your love for your country."
First off Dog, it is very presumptive and assumptive to think I hate anyone because I offer an observation about them that may be a negative observation. In order to make my position regarding Bush very clear, let me start by saying I do not hate people with whom I simply disagree.
It is my opinion Bush has done more to divide and destroy this country than any other one person in the history of the US. I view him as arrogant, bullheaded, simple minded, bordering on amoral and excels in the inability to admit to making any mistakes. Notice I did not use the word hate anywhere in my opinion/statement. Had I felt hate for him I would have no problem saying so. The one word I did forget to insert is evil. I believe the man to be evil. He is, imo, the nearest thing to the proverbial antichrist people refer to.
It is because I do love my country that I speak out. Bush's record, with regards to what is good for our country, exceeds an F grade (whatever that might be). I can't think of one single person who could have done a worse job.
I do agree with you about illegals. The solution to that problem is to take away all the subsidies (freebies) to illegals, ignore their demands and fine them and their employers heavily. IMO, they have no rights if they are here against the law, in other words, illegally.
One can take a pig out of the sty, dress it up and call it a dog til the end of time. This, however, will never change the fact that a pig is a pig is a pig.
Posted on January 14, 2008 12:53 PM
Surprised little Danny and nitpicker aren't just espousing all sorts of "ideas" on this thread!
Good post Yvonne.
Posted on January 14, 2008 6:11 PM
Flashback from Denzien, quite a leftie but quite a nice guy. Relevant because I've not even posted on this thread:
Just go on and profess your love, DemonDeacon, and get it over with. I know I'm not alone in saying I'm tired of watching you flirt with Dan.
I hate to call you out, but it's EVERY single thread. Damn. Grow up.
Posted by: Denzien at January 15, 2007 06:06 PM
Posted on January 14, 2008 8:49 PM
And tomorrow will be the one year anniversary of that post. Alas Denzien, your sage advice was never heard.
Posted on January 14, 2008 8:52 PM
Yvonne [TypeKey Profile Page] said:
"It is my opinion Bush has done more to divide and destroy this country than any other one person in the history of the US. I view him as arrogant, bullheaded, simple minded, bordering on amoral and excels in the inability to admit to making any mistakes."
We nearly agree, Yvonne. Iif the President was changed to "Clinton" and the words "bordering on" before amoral were deleted, add disbarred attorney and lying in grand jury testimony, we would be in agreement!
Posted on January 14, 2008 10:00 PM
Nice approach, Nic. Isn't it wonderful we can disagree in such a civil way?
Posted on January 15, 2008 8:17 AM