News-Record.com

I'd like a point of reference for this...like maybe one or two of these 'numerous statements.'

A firm and unyielding belief in "racism" is so very necessary - for racism allows the blame to be shifted away from those actually responsible and makes it possible for the finger to pointed elsewhere. If not for racism how else could the so very many problems which exist in the black community be explained away ?

rahrah, here is the big one that raised many eyebrows:

"Though this nation has proudly thought of itself as an ethnic melting pot, in things racial, we have always been and we -- I believe continue to be in too many ways essentially a nation of cowards," Holder told Department of Justice employees at an event Wednesday celebrating Black History Month.

He said that Americans are afraid to talk about race, adding that "certain subjects are off-limits and that to explore them risks at best embarrassment and at worst the questioning of one's character."

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/19/holder.folo/

What an uplifting sentiment from a senior govt. official shortly after the first black president was sworn into office.

I agree with him that it is difficult to talk about race, this due to self-imposed political correctness by race baiters, white and black alike imo. Say anything that could be remotely interpreted as racist and the PC crowd will label you a racist faster greased lightning.

rahrah; One of Holder's earliest addresses to the nation, as AG, called us "cowards" when it coms to race, and called for a "dialogue on race". I don't know about you, but I'm 61, and we've been talking about race all my life. People like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton make a living, a very good living, doing nothing but talking about race and stirring the puddin'.

I tend to agree with Monica, the charge of racism is just a handy excuse for bad behavior, which results from bad culture. It will be interesting to see how the residents of Fargo, ND, handle the aftermath of their flooding, as opposed to, say, New Orleans. My guess is that the good folk of Fargo will conduct themselves like human beings, what's your guess? And what is your explanation for it?

"Holder’s negative views on race are not helpful"

From the perspective of divisive race baiting they were exemplary.

C'mon sawdust, don't you predict the residents of Fargo, ND will be living in govt. supplied trailers for years to come?

3 Years Later, Katrina Trailers Close

"Most of the families leaving the trailer parks are eligible for government-subsidized housing until March 2009. Those who can't prove where they were living when the hurricanes struck, or who are ineligible for other reasons, get one more month in an apartment or motel room paid for by FEMA."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/05/31/national/main4142655.shtml

Dan; at least we won't have to worry about them trashing a cruise ship, provided free of charge to give them a place to live. I heard an interview yesterday with the owner of the cruise line who did just that for the po' folk of the Big Easy. Took 'em 6 months to repair the damages, like some of the "projects" here on dry land. Get something for free, trash it, and then bitch if the taxpayers won't replace it with a bigger and better one. Complete housing projects are built, trashed, demolished, and re-built, all at taxpayer expense, on a regular basis. And what do we get for our money? A more civilized and grateful people? Nope, we get crack whores, drug dealers, and streets full of litter and crime. Who could possibly oppose that? The politics of envy, practiced to perfection by B. Hussein Obama.

Pootie Tang: Cole me on the panny sty.
Bob Costas: ...I'm sorry. What was that?
Pootie Tang: Cole - Cole me on the panny sty.
Bob Costas: What the hell are you talking about?
Pootie Tang: ...Cole me down on the panny sty?
Bob Costas: Oh, cole me down on the panny sty! All right!

If anyone has earned the right to complain about racism in the US, it's Eric Holder.

He was aboard the slave ship 'Jesus' that arrived in the colonies in 1620. He made Jefferson's bed and washed his clothes. He picked cotton on Tara while his siblings carried Scarlett O'Hara's skirt tails around. He was the student Bull Conner blocked at the college entrance and he was the one that got away when the honorable Robert Byrd and a few of his friends were having a little necktie party in down Beckley way.

Hey, Ms Thiery, you seem to be offended by Mr. Holder's remarks! Well, I'm not offended at all! I believe he tells it (rather provocatively) "like it is!" He "talks the talk!" For racism is still alive and doing well in our nation. And just too many folks are too cowardly to say, to shout anything about it! (You'll guess wrong........I'm white!)

How is this for some honest dialouge . . . I don't think there is a problem saying it . . . but there is a black problem hearing it . . .

• According to the latest US Department of Justice survey of crime victims, more than 6.6 million violent crimes (murder, rape, assault and robbery) are committed in the US each year, of which about 20 per cent, or 1.3 million, are inter-racial crimes.

• Most victims of race crime—about 90 per cent—are white, according to the survey "Highlights from 20 Years of Surveying Crime Victims", published in 1993.

• Almost 1 million white Americans were murdered, robbed, assaulted or raped by black Americans in 1992, compared with about 132,000 blacks who were murdered, robbed, assaulted or raped by whites, according to the same survey.

• Blacks thus committed 7.5 times more violent inter-racial crimes than whites even though the black population is only one-seventh the size of the white population. When these figures are adjusted on a per capita basis, they reveal an extraordinary disparity: blacks are committing more than 50 times the number of violent racial crimes of whites.

• According to the latest annual report on murder by the Federal Bureau of Investigation, most inter-racial murders involve black assailants and white victims, with blacks murdering whites at 18 times the rate that whites murder blacks.

These breathtaking disparities began to emerge in the mid-1960's, when there was a sharp increase in black crime against whites, an upsurge which, not coincidentally, corresponds exactly with the beginning of the modern civil rights movement.

Over time, the cumulative effect has been staggering. Justice Department and FBI statistics indicate that between 1964 and 1994 more than 25 million violent inter-racial crimes were committed, overwhelmingly involving black offenders and white victims, and more than 45,000 people were killed in inter-racial murders. By comparisons 58,000 Americans died in Vietnam, and 34,000 were killed in the Korean war.

When non-violent crimes (burglary, larceny, car theft and personal theft) are included, the cumulative totals become prodigious. The Bureau of Justice Statistics says 27 million non-violent crimes were committed in the US in 1992, and the survey found that 31 per cent of the robberies involved black offenders and white victims (while only 2 per cent in the reverse).

When all the crime figures are calculated, it appears that black Americans have committed at least 170 million crimes against white Americans in the past 30 years.

Have some reality with your stupid flakes . . .

"I agree with him that it is difficult to talk about race,"

So you agree with him? It's not like the guy singled out whites as cowards...he said we're a "nation of cowards." A nation...that's everyone.

But I guess everyone's angry because it's probably true. The best we get when we talk about race is snarky comments and -izzles, and some of us probably feel really good about ourselves because, hey, "I've got a black friend."

This doesn't make dialogue though. Discussing how you really feel about race and listening to others, not necessarily accepting them as right or wrong, but as valid. Dialogue is honest telling and honest listening. For some reason, we don't really have it, at least not on large scale. Eric Holder thinks it's because we're afraid to...and he might be right.

So, JPeterman, if your report is accurate, what is your explanation of the "facts?" I'm very interested to know your opinion. As they say, "there are lies, damn lies, and statistics." And I would like to know the "truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth." Talk to me!

"Apparently, Mr. Holder cannot admit that along with some shameful incidents perpetrated against mankind in general..." Ms. Thiery, Mr. Holder's frame of reference was the US and its history on race. You can try to gloss over it, but, any cursory glance at race relations, especially, that of the South, paints a different picture.

JPRT, your computer keyboard must be missing some keys. You know the ones that prevent you from commenting on those white males, such as the one in Carthage, who killed all of those innocent people. It must be nice to look through that type of lens. You've discovered that there are some black males who commit violent crimes. That isn't new.

J.Pete,

If that wasn't a copy and paste, then I say well done. I know it wasn't plagarism, that's only for wannabes like Jeri Rowe.

As for whites not raping blacks, that speaks for itself.

Barns are far more romantic than the hood.

Your remarks are "right on target," conundrum. Applause!

rarah, you speak "common sense" also! Applause!

Gunch, you need therapy. Yes you do!

Conundrum,

White people are far more sinister than blacks. Being diabolical takes brains.

As for living in the U.S. with blacks, it's like saving for a S.Dak. vacation only to find a window washing crew dangling across the faces of Rushmore.

Or imagining Billy Graham smoking crack.

Or Jesus showing underwear.

Angels with ghetto blasters...

...it discombobulates.

. . . these facts are the reality in which we live . . . turning a blind eye will not change the statistical data . . . 'what is ya ignant?'

I still love Molene's rawness . . . it takes balls to stand up to ghetto punks . . . of any disadvantaged color . . .

. . . this country needs more balls and less ghetto bullets . . .

BTW I'm down with the Barn idea . . .

Your're just "same-o, same-o," JPeterman....a senseless gobbledygooker!

Here's a little gem for the race-obsessed to mull over:

"Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against these white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of Black Theology is to kill Gods who do not belong to the black community. Black Theology will accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white enemy. What we need is the divine love as expressed in Black Power, which is the power of black people to destroy their oppressors here and now by any means at their disposal. Unless God is participating in this holy activity, we must reject his love".

Anybody know who said that?

Here's a little gem for the race-obsessed to mull over:

"Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against these white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of Black Theology is to kill Gods who do not belong to the black community. Black Theology will accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white enemy. What we need is the divine love as expressed in Black Power, which is the power of black people to destroy their oppressors here and now by any means at their disposal. Unless God is participating in this holy activity, we must reject his love".

Anybody know who said that?

Sorry about the double post. Is it just me, or is this site a bit difficult at times? Probably just me.

Rev. Wright. Way to prove your point, Sawdust. You pick one man out and attribute his remarks (taken out of context at that) to a whole race. How narrow-minded is that?

Jprt,

If a man ties a dog up, beats it, starves it, tortures it, kicks it, refuses to take it to the vet, withholds water and the dog then bites him, who is responsible?

Yvonne; wrong, try again (you are in the ballpark)

conundrum
To say that JPRT is picking an choosing his statistics, is in itself a form of racism. What information do you have that can show that he is picking and choosing only statistics that reflect negetively against African-Americans? If you have that information, then please share it with us. If you don't have any information that can dispute JPRT's post, then don't make such accusations.
I guess black on white crime is one of those "off limits subjects" that Dan spoke of earlier.

As far as zeus80 is concerned, he never says anything of substance, he mainly just spouts insults.

Beachwalker, I've never said that it is wrong for JPRT to use statistics. My argument is that he be fair (if that is possible). The majority of crime victims who are preyed upon by black criminals, are not white, they are black. So, to portray this as a Birth of A Nation type thing, is a complete fabrication. Secondly, he used figures that go back as far as 1992. Would you use figures from 17 yrs ago to make any sort of judgement or argument?

You have to be careful when you use statistics. I could say that there are more whites who receive welfare and I would be accurate. Since whites make up more of the US population, there are more whites who receive government assistance. I could also say that white males make up the majority of the males who sexually prey upon young children and I would once again be accurate. And there is the issue of serial killers. On a black killer's most efficient day, he or she could never match the carnage of a Robert Stewart (the Carthage shooter), John Wayne Gacy, Ted Bundy, Richard Speck or Tim McVeigh, the lattter of which has the blood of children on his hand. Statistics cut both ways!

The quote was by James Cone, the floundering father of Black Liberation Theology, doubly mis-named because it neither liberates nor is true theology. It is the religion of Trinity United Church of Christ, brilliantly articulated by the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, known the world over to be a prince among men. It is, or was for over 20 years, the religion of the POTUS and first beeyatch. That would explain the anger so well concealed by POTUS, so poorly concealed by his bride.

But if I deign to criticize the Odious One, I am the one branded a racist.

When addressing black crime all we hear is yea but, yea but.

Well until you are willing to address the yea there can be no meaningful discourse on but.

I guess we'll just keep proving Eric Holder right.

Criticizing Obama is fine, Sawdust. Statements like:

"....of the POTUS and first beeyatch,"

are probably less fine.

"I agree with him that it is difficult to talk about race,"

So you agree with him?

I agree that it is difficult to talk about race. The main reason is political correctness run amok. When white people criticize the actions of black people they are usually immediately labeled as racists. Hence the silence resultant from the extreme fear of being perceived as such.

conundrum is a black person. When he joined the blog he labeled me a racist:

conundrum said:
I knew that given enough time, that you would show your true racist side. You can use all of the eloquent words and phrases that you want, but when you strip away your veneer, you are a small minded racist at your core.
Posted on February 11, 2008 5:41 PM

I'm not sure if he still believes this after more than a year of dialogue on this blog. But this is my point, it is difficult criticize black people without the race card being played. Probably even more so now that we have a black president. I am very critical of some of his actions (except for picking UNC to win the national championship :) ) but it has nothing to do with the color of his skin. I'm equally critical of Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, and Tim Geithner. One exception to this rule, if the person uttering such criticism is also black, such as Bill Cosby. Even then, some of these are labeled as Uncle Toms.

It's interesting, my kids never mention much about race and skin color. They play with the black kids next door and have black friends in school. The child I mentor, who is black, constantly brings up the subject.

I'll agree with rahrah's last post, using terms like first beeyatch simply adds fuel to the fire.

True constructive dialogue between races cannot take place as long as people deny the existence 0f racism. Some of the people posting here seem to believe it used to exist but does not anymore. They consistently call foul when the race card is played and proceed to negate it rather than explore the possibility that it is a fair play at times.

An example of what I'm talking about is presenting misleading statistics as the proof that white is good and black is bad. When racism is the root of our treatment of blacks in the south, why should blacks not call racism?

I was listening to NPR this morning on the way home from work so I didn't get the whole story. But what I heard seems to bear out the claim of racist behavior by law enforcement in the deep southern states of North and South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana. Although whites and blacks commit the same crime, blacks are more likely to be sent to prison while whites are more likely to get off or serve time in jail on week-ends or the like. When whites are sent to prison, they get lighter sentences, thus serve less time.

Blacks are more likely to be targeted by police so more blacks are caught. If this is not racism, what is? Yet to hear some on this blog tell it, blacks cry racism without reason. When we start treating blacks as equal, there will be no legit reason to play the race card.

Yvonne . . . it's obvious who is responsible . . . but you wouldn't expect the dog's great, great, great, great grand childern to piss on everyone because of that . . . or would you.

I'm not sure anyone here did anything to that dog then . . .

"The main reason is political correctness run amok. When white people criticize the actions of black people they are usually immediately labeled as racists. Hence the silence resultant from the extreme fear of being perceived as such"

Dialogue (as described in my previous post) goes both ways and precludes the playing of any 'race card.' However, if one were to honestly feel that racism was taking place and expressed that feeling, it wouldn't be right to call that any sort of game piece. Using that term, digresses any conversation because a discussion of important issues, like race, should not be considered a game-to-play.

If we could be honest about what we think and feel and open to listening to others without judgment, I think we would get a lot further in solving racial problems.

Because, Dan, only you know if you've got a small-minded racist at your core. And, even if you do, I think it's worth something when a person recognizes the difference between his first impulses and what's right.

Personally, I was raised in a southern, semi-rural family to be respectful and open-minded. However, it was a problem in my family when my cousin dated a young black man, especially for my Dad. And if it were still happening, it would still bother him. With conflicting messages like this, I have found myself wonder if I react differently to people of color.

Honestly, I find it mentally jarring when I see a white and black person in an apparent romantic relationship. Now I have no idea if that disturbance shows up on my face, but I've had to tell myself, "rahrah, they're just two people, that's all." And it's sort of silly. I dated a Korean girl for 2 years and didn't think twice about our racial differences.

And I'm not trying to project my imperfections on anyone else, but I'd bet that most, if not all, have had some 'racist' thought before, and I can promise you that they'll never go away unless we're honest about them.

And what stops us from being honest?

Might it be fear?

First let me say I am not ashamed that I am white. Nor am I ashamed that I have no black friends. if you want to call me a racist, go ahead.

Yvonne, you asked; " Blacks are more likely to be targeted by police so more blacks are caught. If this is not racism, what is?"

It is realism.
If a small minority of people commit the majority of crime, why target everyone but them?

"True constructive dialogue between races cannot take place as long as people deny the existence 0f racism."

I'm not sure if that was directed towards me, but I've never said racism doesn't exist. Just look at some of the folks who post in this blog, it does exist. BTW, there are black people who are racist as well.

That being said, I still stand by my post, many times the race card is played anytime the issue of race arises. I've admitted racism exists and it would be helpful if others admitted the accusation of racism is often inappropriately used.

To explicitly state it, since Dan suggested that it would be helpful:

The accusation of racism is often inappropriately used.

This usually meaning it has been used as an excuse for some questionable action or as enabling device for easier personal gain.

While you have never said that racism doesn't exist, you have suggested that it is not apparent either in or to your children, but that your black Little Brother brings it up often. I would suggest that this might be because racism is much more apparent to those who experience it's ill effects.

'Constructive' dialogue on race ain't gonna happen in our lifetime. Too many race pimps have too much invested in their bogus victimhood. Instead of constructive dialogue, they prefer to wallow in bogus injustices and set in jail because they actually believe white people are responsible for their crack habits and illegitimate birth rates.

Gotta LOVE this from conundrum:
"Would you use figures from 17 yrs ago to make any sort of judgement or argument?"

But going back to the Crusades of the 12th century to whine about the persecution of others by white Christian people or traveling back 400+ years to piss and moan about slavery is perfectly acceptable...Got it.

Were I a minority, I'd be highly offended by the guilt-ridden white liberal toads who view me as too inept and incompetent to take care of myself and have anointed themselves as my protector.

"But going back to the Crusades of the 12th century to whine about the persecution of others by white Christian people or traveling back 400+ years to piss and moan about slavery is perfectly acceptable...Got it."

Because using specific statistics from 1992 and citing patterns that existed continuously for hundreds of years that set blacks at a marked and legislated disadvantage are completely equivalent?

Ahem...

Were I a minority, I'd be highly offended by the guilt-ridden white liberal toads who view me as too inept and incompetent to take care of myself and have anointed themselves as my protector.

"While you have never said that racism doesn't exist, you have suggested that it is not apparent either in or to your children, but that your black Little Brother brings it up often. I would suggest that this might be because racism is much more apparent to those who experience it's ill effects."

The first sentence is correct.

As for the second sentence, this kid is 7 years old, please tell me what ill effects he has suffered due to racism. He doesn't know much about the history of slavery, Jim Crow, segregation, etc. He knows what he is taught by his family and perhaps the schools.

A few statements he's made:

Dan, I wish I could be part of your family but I can't because I'm black.

Dan, I voted for Obama in our school election because he's black.

Dan, my daddy is having a tough time finding a job because he's black. Note, the father is an alcoholic who drives drunk, just had an accident recently, and spends most of his time on the couch watching TV and getting drunk.

I try to explain to this child that we have different skin color but we are all people that God created. Just because he is black and we are white doesn't make anyone better than the other. A work in progress.

**************************************************

Neo, screw being a minority or not, I am highly offended by liberals in govt. who view me as too inept and incompetent to take care of myself and have anointed themselves as my protector. I don't want the govt. overseeing my health care nor my car warranty nor do I want to pay for others car warranties.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/03/30/news/economy/auto_warrantees/index.htm

The govt. handling our car warranties? It gets more pathetic every day.

"please tell me what ill effects he has suffered due to racism"

I can't. The only time I've been a minority is when I went to the beach on the week corresponding to Black Biker Weekend.

Tsh, tsh folks, most of you talk scuttlebutt! Please conclude your arguments by believing that more miscegnation may resolve in the distant future the problem of racism. And (white) ghost from white oak without black friends, you might just have a little black-streak in you! And the same may be true for all of us sourthern whites, especially! Sorry.

Thanks rahrah, I was a minority for two weeks whilst visiting Tanzania. Didn't matter, the people there were so kind and welcoming I felt at one with them.

Yvonne: "Blacks are more likely to be targeted by police so more blacks are caught. If this is not racism, what is?"

Is it racism? If blacks commit crimes at a higher rate (a demonstrable fact with which no one seriously disagrees), is it racist for police to "target" blacks more thoroughly than whites? I would say it's no more "racist" than it would be "sexist" to target men more than women (because men commit more crimes).

"Please conclude your arguments by believing that more miscegnation may resolve in the distant future the problem of racism."

That conclusion from a blogger who has FINALLY offered an argument/suggestion/thought/idea of his/her own. Kudos to zeus. The first zeus argument ever being more black and white people need to have sex together. Go for it as long as I don't have to pay for the resultant offspring. Ditto for any other sexual encounters regardless of race.

I already married a white woman, she may be pissed if I have sex with any other woman regardless of race. Therefore I must bow out. Sorry.

Well now, everyone listen to Dan, the man! He tells us that he is married to a white woman! (but she may have a little streak of you know what!) So, Dan, don't talk so sassy! And relax, you know, of course, that our President is "miscegnatized," and he's doing pretty well! And heck boy, you won't be around in the distant future to worry about these matters! So now just "go to bed, sleep tight, and don't let the boogers bite." (And I feel sorry for your kids!)

Was it not MLK who said " One day I hope that all children are judged by the content of their character and not the color of the color of their skin"?
Yet 40 years after his death there still exists the Congressional Black Caucus, Black Panther Party, NAACP, Black Coaches Association, and many other "black only" fraternaties all over the US.
Well I still think Chris Rock said it best:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7b2oCYgfik&feature=related

conundrum said:
Beachwalker, I've never said that it is wrong for JPRT to use statistics. My argument is that he be fair (if that is possible). The majority of crime victims who are preyed upon by black criminals, are not white, they are black. So, to portray this as a Birth of A Nation type thing, is a complete fabrication. Secondly, he used figures that go back as far as 1992. Would you use figures from 17 yrs ago to make any sort of judgement or argument?

You have to be careful when you use statistics. I could say that there are more whites who receive welfare and I would be accurate. Since whites make up more of the US population, there are more whites who receive government assistance. I could also say that white males make up the majority of the males who sexually prey upon young children and I would once again be accurate. And there is the issue of serial killers. On a black killer's most efficient day, he or she could never match the carnage of a Robert Stewart (the Carthage shooter), John Wayne Gacy, Ted Bundy, Richard Speck or Tim McVeigh, the lattter of which has the blood of children on his hand. Statistics cut both ways!
Yes conundrum statistics do cut both ways considering you never mentioned the "DC Snipers, Atlanta Child Killer, Knoxville Car Jackers and Torturer's or the Eve Carson killers and many others that don't make the pc news.

My point is, which many of you obviously missed, I was not talking about 150 years ago or even 10 years ago, but of TODAY. Racism is alive and well as we have this discussion.

The NPR segment I referred is what happens in present day. When two people, one white and one black, are caught and tried for the SAME crime the black offender receives a much harsher sentence. Now please explain to me how blacks are "pissing" on the head of the white man about the things that happened 150 years ago? And while you are at it, also explain to me how it is not the white man who is continuing to perpetuate the behaviors of our ancestors that discriminated against blacks?

I am all for holding people responsible for their behavior and am not excusing wrong-doing no matter what the color of a person's skin. However, I am not about assuming guilt nor punishing one more harshly because of skin color either. But it seems as if I am in the minority, amongst most of the bloggers here, in thinking beyond skin color.

It was pretty well summed up by the Rev. Jesse Jackson, when he related the tale of walking down the street after dark. He became aware of someone behind him, and was relieved to see that it was a white person. Jesse knows the score.

"And heck boy, you won't be around in the distant future to worry about these matters! So now just "go to bed, sleep tight, and don't let the boogers bite." (And I feel sorry for your kids!)"

Demon Deacon redux except he had some intelligence. Exact same language however, I'm suspicious.

Why don't you guys ask JP why he always bring up these type of comments? What is he trying to prove?

Is his intentions good or bad?

I believe there are lots of prejudices in a lot of people on this blog. Majority of posters refuse to acknowledge it.

I'd like to hear the clip or read a transcript, Yvonne. Please post a link.

I'm betting they were just playing the hits. It's unlikely that any two people will be "caught and tried for the SAME crime" (no, I'm not talking about the SAME same crime) because everything each of us does up to any given moment is completely different.

Any past charges? Have an unpaid parking ticket? Dodged $34k in taxes? Wear a suit to court? Say "sir" or "ma'am" to the judge? Curse? Act aloof? It all matters in a courtroom, and, even in the same state, all courtrooms are different.

And did any whites who committed the SAME crime as the white guy get a different sentence? If so, the black/white premise collapses.

See the problem?
--

Brainwashed- New to the internet? "Majority of posters refuse to acknowledge it" is very true.

(random grab)
http://www.linuxextremist.com/2006/07/10/dont-feed-the-trolls/

You don't feed the trolls. Acknowledging it fuels it. Most know to ignore it.

Roger,

It was on NPR Tuesday morning about 0730-0800. I keep the radio in all my cars tuned to NPR and it was on when I got in my car to leave work. I listened to it all the way home (which would be about 10 minutes). It should be easy enough for you to find, if you have the interest.

I can see your points, Yvonne, and agree with some of them.

I don't really understand this, though: "And while you are at it, also explain to me how it is not the white man who is continuing to perpetuate the behaviors of our ancestors that discriminated against blacks?" If this is a sweeping indictment of white men and their (our) treatment of blacks, then I find this to be in the exact same category as JP's sweeping indictment of blacks and their propensity towards crime. It's either possible or likely I misunderstand the this though, if so, apologies.

When I was younger I lived in a major metropolitan area. My neighborhood was overwhelmingly black. I was the only white person in several blocks.

I was victimized by crime twice. Once, while walking home, a guy can up, jammed a gun in my face and asked for my wallet. He got it. the second time I was, again, walking home when a couple of young punks cracked me on the noggin but good with a bottle. They got a couple of bucks as well. I harbor a great grudge against these 3 individuals, whom all happened to be black.

I have no allusions they targeted me due to my race. They were just waiting for the first sap to wander by. It was me. Several other neighbors got robbed and beaten at different times. One got shot. The other victims were all black. Our neighborhood had at least 3 members who were terrible, rotten people.

The acts of those 3 persons are not, in any way, indicitive of any other person in the neighborhood.

I often see, including on these boards if memory serves me (which it might not) people decrying any form of reparations. "I never owned a slave, so why should I pay a nickle, and no one alive was ever a slave, so why should they get a nickle?" This or a similar argument.

The main gist of such an argument is that accountability cannot be allocated to any except the party at fault.

Good argument, seems like.

Likewise, with the 3 jack-asses in my old neighborhood, their shenanigans are only attributable to themselves. No other black person in the neighborhood need even consider repudiating their acts, just like I have no need to repudiate the acts of Ed Gein.

With crime, though, there are many layers that must be considered. Race, opportunity, resources, family support.

If a person gets convicted of a crime, the sentencing judge often has some discretion on what to do with the person.

What has the person done, and what are they likely to do. If a person, or their family has resources, they can do a lot to ease the sentencing judge's mind. Enroll in rehab (ever heard of a politician of some resources doing that?) Admitting to having a problem and seeking treatment outside of court can help in sentencing. Look at Sidney Lowe's kid. He got a hell of a discount from his presumptive sentence for this reason. So this kinda turns into a question of resources. Do blacks, in general, have less resources than whites? I think this is probably so.

Other things the judge will want to know is what is the person going to do later in life. Do they have a chance to turn things around or are they simply a lost cause. If the judge thinks they are lost, then expect the maximum sentence, I would imagine. Having two parents and a dedicated extended family being able and willing to provide support to straighten out a convict paints a better picture than does having no one but an impoverished single mother with other kids she is struggling to raise to the best of her abilities. Blacks are more likely to be born into single parent families.

Another factor is gut feelings. I think many people are more prone to allocate scariness and propensity for violence towards blacks. A large black man can be intimidating for many people, giving them a desire to want to lock him away for safety. This factor is undeniably racist.

There are probably many other factors I haven't mentioned. Many of them are not necessarily racist. The effect may appear to be racist, but I wouldn't agree that the implimentation or consideration would be racist. But I think that there does exist a degree of racism.

How much is this degree? That, to me, and I think to Yvonne and others, is the million dollar question.

I believe it exists. And I believe that it causes actual undeserved harm to certain people and provides undeserved assistance to others. Is it as bad a problem as it was 50 years ago? No. Will it be better 50 years from now? I truly believe so.

Alright, the rant is over. Thank you, thank you! I'm here all week. Try the veal and remember to tip the waitstaff.

JSD,

I agree with your rant. You make some very astute observations, none of which I find any issue with.

As I have said many times, my association with black people started when I was three or so. Unlike you, I have never been harmed by anyone black. However, if I was, like you I would hold the individual responsible, not an entire race.

A dear friend visited this past weekend. I felt truly blessed by that visit. She calls me "Mama number 1" and I love her like my kids. She, being black and I, being white, are able to discuss our true feelings without reservations. She said she, and most black people, could tell when white folks spoke from the heart and when they spoke from the mind. She told me she knew I saw people rather than color. It warmed my heart as seeing people is what I really do.

Also like you, justsomedude, I hope the future will continue to improve with regards to racial harmony. In fact, I pray our nation will work together to recover and heal.

My statement did sound like a sweeping generalization and I apologize for that. Sometimes I put this blog within the confines of a box and fail to realize I am not being clear. Most of the people who post here are white. This is by their own descriptions, not mine. So no assumptions on my part. If you follow all the discussions on race, as I do, you will note a pattern of blame and snide remarks about blacks in general. Usually the same ones who deny being racists are the ones who are the most vocal (in anonymity of course) about blacks being responsible for most of our country's ills. These are the "white man" I was addressing, be they man or woman.

BTW, where is here? I usually do not care for veal but, on a good recommendation, am willing to try it again. And fwiw, I was tipping 15-20% when it was popular to tip 5-10%. Now I usually tip 20-30%, the higher being for exceptional service.

rb--

"Brainwashed- New to the internet? "Majority of posters refuse to acknowledge it" is very true."

Hmm, good question. My first online chatting was in 95-96 (I think late 95). So I guess I'm new to the internet.

And you are correct: "Acknowledging it fuels it."

. . . figures that go back as far as 1992 . . . has it gotten any better? Point . . .

"Why don't you guys ask JP why he always brings up these type of comments? What is he trying to prove? "

. . . the things I bring up are at the root of all of our problems . . . and it bothers race baiters to hear-see-text these things they know to be truths . . . change them don't 'gerry-curl' over them . . .

. . . these "black" facts are indefensible . . . I share no more sorrow or accept the excuse . . . shameful and totally in-human . . . a blight and downfall to humans.

remember this blog was based upon Eric Holder's slanted verbage . . . as if anyone here is afraid of talking about race, I think not . . .

. . . rather what we see today, around us . . . we perceive as a reality . . . welcome to my tour . . . let the truth in offending begin in ernest . . . statistics shall be our honesty . . .

Yep, same rules still apply, BW.

Yvonne, I'd already searched before asking. I figured with it being your source and you knowing specific keywords and phrases that were used that you might have more success at finding it.

Regardless, the point stands. Any similar white/white (or black/black) differences in sentencing for the same crime would foil the white/black racial disparity premise.

My apology, Roger. I thought it would be easy to find the interview once given the info. Well, after reading your last post, I tried to find it by typing in key words. What I found was a study, a very long study, that I think may have been the basis for the interview as it reflect some of the very same material almost word for word. You can find that study at: http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/osjcl/Articles/Volume5_1/Mauer-PDF.pdf

I was taken to this site from the NPR site and do not know how to make it a "click on" link. Sorry.

Thanks Yvonne.