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Tracking teacher turnover

In today's paper we report that Guilford County Schools lost about 12 percent of its teachers in 2004-05.

A more exact percentage is 11.8 percent, compared with 11.49 percent the year before. Numberwise, turnover was 586 of 4,962 teachers compared with 589 of 5,125 teachers the year before.

Districts must report turnover to the state annually. State officials compile the data and prepare a report that should come out in early September. That will give us an idea of how the state is doing overall and how Guilford compares to other districts.

The report looks at why teachers are leaving, for example: retirement, personal reasons, relocation, another teaching job elsewhere in the state or out-of-state, career change, even disatisfaction with teaching. Read Guilford's report to the state here. (You'll have to scroll down a little bit until you see the headline 'GCS Teacher Turnover Information Reported to DPI')

At first glance, those numbers won't make sense. How could the district have fewer teachers when it is growing by an average 1,000 students per year, creating a need for more teachers? Add to that the push to lower class size, which creates more teaching positions, and your reaction might be the same as mine when I saw the numbers -- HUH?

So I asked Mike Harris, chief of human resources, about the discrepancy. He said the state has changed the way it calculates teacher turnover. Certain categories aren't included anymore. Two examples are long-term subs and Visiting International Faculty, the foreign exchange teachers who typically work three-year contracts in a district before returning home.

So the two years can't be directly compared. If I'm doing this math right in my head (hey, don't make fun, we can't all be math wizards!) then turnover was actually probably somewhat higher in 2003-04 if you go by this new state calculation.

On one hand, it makes sense not to include the VIF and long-term subs in teacher turnover. You know they are there for only a specified amount of time. So in terms of this particular state report, it's not going to help a school district reduce its turnover by tracking why teachers are leaving. You already know these teachers are temporary and why they are leaving. You can't change that and there are reasons why schools have to use these temporary teachers: to cover classrooms when there is an illness or a teacher is pregnant; and in the case of VIF teachers, to bring world cultures to local students.

On the other hand, turnover also shows us how often the academic leader in a classroom changes. That certainly has an impact on kids and how they learn.

The old state method of reporting turnover gave a truer sense of what is happening in the classroom.

Another teacher turnover number will come out with the state report cards in October. This one will include in-district transfers from school to school. So teachers who aren't included in the state teacher turnover report because they're still with the district will be tracked to some degree through the report card.

This number tracks only the percentage of teachers at your school at the end of the previous year who are still there at the beginning of the reported year. (Here's a link to the old report cards for 2003-04. Type in your school name, click on the "Quality Teachers" tab and scroll down to "Teacher Turnover Rate.")

Do any of these methods truly indicate teacher turnover in the classroom? I'm not so sure. The report card figure is more effective than the state teacher turnover number. But what if that "last teacher" who ended school year "A" and came back for school year "B" was actually the third one little Johnny and Susie had in year "A"? Who tracks those mid-year changes?

Well, that's it. Teacher turnover in a nutshell. Got it? There will be a quiz in the morning.

Comments (22)

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Joe Stafford said:

Turnover is way too high. Hundreds of highly qualified teachers that love children and want to teach do not teach because they feel that the support that they need is not available in Guilford County. The training of teachers for inter-city work is marginal. So many of the teachers that quit believe that the pursuit of excellance in not a priority in Guilford County. Teachers are still fighting AYP when they need to get on board and learn how to teach every child in the class. I wish we would quit placing rookie teachers in inter-city schools. We don't give teachers a second chance. If they cannot take the environment and quit, the BOE recommends that their license be pulled. We waste a lot of good talent this way.

Buckmtn said:

I'll bet you if all of these numbers are given to that $100k plus Statistician that the Central Office hired a complete explanation will be given.

As a matter of fact Dr. Grier may need to hire additional staff to study this situation.

Andi said:

Excellent points! Teachers need more support, especially our new teachers. There are mentors available, but the mentoring program is not as strong as it could be. Also, new teachers definitely should not be placed in inner-city schools unless they have completed their student teaching in one and were successful.

My first year in GCS was a miserable one because I was completely unprepared for the needs and behavior problems of my students at a "high needs" school. With more experience and training under my belt, I could have been far more effective.

Also, if a teacher chooses to break their contract, they are suspended for a year from teaching in GCS--if they give notice ahead of time (I believe it has to be at least a 30 day notice). However, it would be next to impossible to find a teaching job in GCS after doing this. If a teacher quits without giving at least a month's notice, they lose their teaching license. Sadly enough, some teachers have chosen to quit and give up teaching rather than to keep putting up with crap.

In reference to the teacher turnover rate, I think it is more interesting to look at the turnover rates at each school (available by going to the GCS website and looking at a school's individual report card) rather than looking at an overall average. You can clearly see then which schools are losing the most teachers. However, you must keep in mind that the teacher turnover rate for each school does not tell you what percentage were teachers who retired.

Dean Wormer said:

Jennifer,

While we are talking about turnover, why haven't you or Bruce mentioned John Wright's departure? Wright is a high ranking member of the district, and nothing has been reported by you about his departure. It was reported in a rival newspaper last week.

The report that I saw said that he was taking leave for one year as allowed by the Family Medical Leave Act. It was also reported that Terry Grier said that he would be paid for that year as required by the FLMA, but this is questionable as the FLMA only requires "unpaid" leave of absence for family emergencies. Also, FLMA doesn't require the approval of absences for the length of one year. Would you investigate this matter and report on it. It's reasonable since you are reporting on teacher turnover, so what about executive turnover?

This timing of this also seems strange as Wright is responsible for administrative services, and GCS is entering some massive construction projects of which he would have been responsible. Won't his experience and leadership be sorely missed by GCS at this time?

Michelle said:

Great question Dean Wormer. One YEAR of paid leave??? I couldn't believe it when I read it in the competing paper. I just took a quick look at the FMLA, and it says that the employee gets 12 weeks in any 12-month period, of UNPAID leave. Furthermore, the employer may REQUIRE the employee to use accrued paid leave, such as vacation or sick leave. I have a feeling John Wright has a bit of some type of accrued time built up. This would be the time to use it.

Dean Wormer said:

Michelle,

That's true, but how do you get to one year paid leave, when the law only requires 12 weeks? Something isn't adding up here in Guilford County. And, would Wright have accumulated 52 weeks of unused sick leave and/or vacation? that's quite a bit.

Michelle said:

Dean Wormer,
I was not clear in my point, evidently. I am saying that only 12-weeks are required. That is in a 12 month period. I can't believe that Guilford County Schools will give 12 months of paid leave saying that that is what is required under FMLA. I also did not mean do imply that Mr. Wright actually had 52 weeks of accrued leave time (although one might be surprised. When I lived in CT, we had town employees retire who had accumulated amazing amounts of sick, vacation, and personal days, and the way it worked was, if they hadn't used it, when they retired they got paid for it all at once). I just meant that IF an employer was required to grant an employee leave by the FMLA, the employer CAN REQUIRE that the employee use any accrued leave time the employee may have. Regarding Mr. Wright's personal case, having (I assume) been a Guilford County Schools employee for some time, he MAY have built up some accrued leave. Wouldn't the illness of a family member be one reason to use up accrued time?

Gamblin Man said:

Jennifer/Bruce,

Were you able to find out the number of High Point Lottery assignment appeals this year, how many were granted, how many were rejected?

bruce buchanan said:

We requested that information weeks ago, Gamblin Man, but we still haven't received it from GCS. But we've been told it's coming.

We will publish something as soon as we get that information.

jennifer fernandez said:

Gamblin Man,

I actually left another message last week for that very same information. I'm still waiting to hear back. I'll try again after ABCs come out tomorrow.

Gamblin Man said:

Jennifer and Bruce,

Thanks for your responses. I'll look forward to the info when you have it. With school starting in 3 weeks, I certainly hope all the families who appealed have received their decision.

Reassigned said:

We got a decision alright!

As school gets closer and closer I still cant believe that we have to send our child to a school that is miles away.

We live 0.63 miles away from SW.

debora said:

all the 'special meetings' the BOE has been having are for the reassignment appeals. State law says the entire board has to hear any appeals even after the 3 person team hears the argument. What happens is you don't get your first choice, you ask for an appeal. Three BOE members make up a panel, they listen/question you. Then they form a recommendation. They then take that recommendation (student doesn't know their recommendation) to the entire board and they discuss each appeal. They have had 4 or more meetings this summer about that. Don't know if they have more planned or if they are through

Barbara Ann said:

Deb,

Glad to be back in town for awhile to catch up on things. Thanks for keeping us informed as always.

Maybe this explains why it is taking so long to get the final results.

Joe,

How's it going on those raises for subs??

Buckmtn said:

We've got you beat Reassigned, we're just .3 miles and under a 10 minute walk from the high school. My daughter and her friends walked home from SW Middle every afternoon in less than 15 minutes.

Joe Stafford said:

Alan Duncan has promised me that when he knows the final amount that the State will fund Guilford County Schools, he will take a look at sub pay. I understand he may agree to a $2 per day raise "if funds are available". I don't fully understand why he doesn't say in public what he told me in private. I hope the sub raise will not fall thru the crack. My present position is to give the BOE some time to do the right thing. It does not seem to be a priority to the BOE.

debora said:

Joe,
Thanks for the info, I was at one meeting where Alan asked how much it would cost to give everysub $1 per day raise. I think that $1 or even $2 is an insult! With taxes etc that only gives the appearance of caring, not actually helping anyone. Anyone that subs full time -and very few work everyday; even though they could-- (20 days per week) would be $40 minus taxes so say around $30-- that would perhaps buy their gas for 1 week!

I guess that might help, but still the thought of $1 is just ridiculous! Most people due this because they want to be available for their own families and they love children, but we need to somehow value them more!

reassigned said:

Buckmtn,
would like to say you win but I think we both lost right!

Beth said:

I feel that the constant cut of teacher assistants (a good deal at a low cost) is hurting our elementary schools.
Consider being in a classroom of 20-30 children, trying to teach, handle constant disruptions, keep children on task, etc.) with no one to help with small group lessons, children's needs, emergencies, discipline & the list goes on.
Officials should visit the classrooms more often, talk with teachers & find out how valuable a good teacher assistant is in the education process of our children.
I am a SIMS operator in a school (I won't leave my name:) and having been in the system for several years, I have seen the difference since teacher assistant positions have been steadily declining.
After reading your article, I just needed to vent a little.
Thanks & have a great day!

john said:

Quite intresting article posting.I enjoyed reading this.

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