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Why should discussion of goals be in closed session?

General,

You can't wear a tux; you need to wear your uniform with all the stars and stripes. All of us corporals will come in our military gear as well.

Can someone go on a mission and disconnect Dot's mike? And Deena's too!!!!!

Bruce,

Anita map1 first shown on Oct27 is different to the HS map (Anita 2) shown at the last meeting. A couple of differences noted are the on HS map A1 all of Jamestown meadows would go to Ragdale and the lines for division between SW, Andrews and Central are different through Oak Hollow Lake.
What is the reason for this? Did the first map look too good?
What about an explanation?

To me if Jamestown meadows goes to Ragsdale a lot of the overcrowding problems go away at SW and the JM crowd would be happy.

Is this part of the Susan/Dot plan to kill it.
Remember they are biding their time/biting their lips and waiting to make that motion to kill!

Joe,

I thought the same thing. Why would the goals have be discussed in closed session?

Perhaps they are going to have some general ideas of goals and then present in public? I e-mailed off my extensive notes/suggestion to the SB today. I hope you will do the same before the next SB meeting.

"Question",

Where are you viewing the two different maps? They are about impossible to read on line with a bunch of stars jammed together and no explanation.

I think the last two maps presented were just for elementary and middle school zones if that helps any. I heard them mention they overlay the high school lines (I think).

Maybe the maps are difficult to read on purpose so when/if there are public forums how will anyone know what to question if they don't know which school they are tentatively being assigned to.

Question,

Do you mean Jamesford Meadows? If not,where is Jamestown Meadows located?

Also, why did the board bother with option 2 on the school calendar?

Option 1 features a start date of August 25, 2006, with the last day of school being June 8, 2007.
This option features:

Fairly equal grading periods

Teacher workdays spread throughout the school year

A teacher workday on Nov 22 (prior to the Thanksgiving holiday)

Eight days of vacation/holidays for winter break
A workday following winter break for teachers to prepare before students return

Five days of vacation/holidays for spring break

Option 2 features a start date of September 5, 2006, with the last day of school being June 8, 2007.
This option features:

A post-Labor Day start

Equal grading periods

Limited time for eighth grade students to prepare for the state mandated computer skills test (usually administered the first week of October)

No snow make-up days during the school year (stacked at the end)

Increased financial liability with regards to teacher pay dates – teachers would be advanced pay for 18 days on August 31

Oops meant Jamesford meadows.

Barbara, the maps are very readable. You can find them in the board meeting materials on the GCSB website for both Oct27 and Nov 8.

Bruce, it does appear these people are absolutely right about the map discrepancies. There is also a hard to notice change that swithched the Oak Hollow Estates area east of White's Mill into Andrews in DIRECT CONTRADICTION to the "neigborhood school" directive for the first series of maps.

What one would have to wonder IS who made the changes and why. Most likeley not done by Eric. The devil most likely is in the details. This is something people have a right to know and and enterprising reporter should get an answer.

Yeah, I see those changes now that you mention them - they are subtle, but there definitely are differences. I'll try to get some answers on that. If nothing else, I'll be at the board meeting Thursday and should be able to get it straightened out then.

It's worth noting, though, that these maps are just rough drafts. Any changes in attendance lines must be approved by the school board and you, the public, will have an opportunity to let the board know how you feel before any decisions are made - and this particular set of maps is just one idea under consideration.

Still, those discrepancies need an explanation. I'll see what I can find out.

The maps were presented at the board meeting and should NOT be tampered with. If the board or Eric want to come up with a different version, then so be it but make a NEW map with a different name.

This behind-closed-doors re-drawing makes this already smelly board even more rancid.

I hope Anita is watching her maps closely. Of course none have been voted on yet, but once presented at a board meeting, they should remain intact.

I hate to be an "I told ya so" but I do remembering saying that these maps would NEVER be "Anita's Maps". Especially the maps of the High Point Schools.

LONG LIVE THE SCREWING OF HIGH POINT STUDENTS!!!

I think the explanation is that the first map was High School only and showed everyone at their closest high school.

The next set of maps included elementary, middle, and high. This time I think Eric started with Elementary and tried to determine feeder patterns to Middle and then on to High School.

A special commendation goes to the News-Record today for its article in the ops section written by a former GCS school teacher. The writer states some plain sense point-of-view that confirms what many have been saying on this board for the past year. In essence, that Terry Grier and his central office needs to take a lesser role in the schools to improve the educational process. This article hits the nail squarely. Now, we need a retraction from Terry Grier stating why the author is incorrect.

Hey all, there really isn't any big mystery why the maps where changed. When you are dealing with this crowd, you should expect to be dealt from the bottom of the deck when they think that you aren't looking. How do you think Dotty was named to All-State, for her good deeds? No, she has had decades to learn how to manipulate everything to her satisfaction. And, she has willing accomplices in Terry Grier and Susan Mendenhall. I'm sure one of Grier's secret goals is to fight any resistance to elimination of the lottery and punish those that do fight it.

Numbersgame has a good explanation. I do recall something being said at last week's meeting about feeder patterns, so I bet that accounts for the discrepancy. I'll double-check that, though.

But there's nothing to say that the school board must use feeder patterns or that students must follow each other from elementary to middle to high school.

For example, students from Acme Acres and Vedder Woods (I'm making up names here, FYI) could attend the same elementary school and middle school. But the kids from Acme Acres could then go to one high school and the kids from Vedder Woods could attend another high school, if that made sense geographically and space-wise.

Question,

Maybe you can read them. You must be young with good eyes. (I even have a large computer screen.) They don't list many streets or landmarks and so many things overlap, it is hard to even read the names of the schools on some (too many stars covering them). The average person who has not followed the issues for the past several years would have no idea how to interpret these. I have heard many people comment the maps are hard to read on line. Even the SB asked for some feeder patterns in writing at the last meeting to be included with the maps.

I just called Eric myself to get the answers on certain areas. He was very helpful and answered my questions.

To whomever asked about the high school map changing, you are correct. The elementary and middle schools recent maps consider the feeder patterns. Based on the public comments (is what I was told) people wanted consistent feeder patterns. This was also one of the main parameters of 1999 redistricting along with eliminating satellite zones (where one neighborhood would bypass another closer school to get to assigned school.)

BRUCE,

CAN YOU POST THE ARTICLE ON PAGE A7 "Six Ideas for Schools in Guilford" by Richard B. O'Neal? I think the CB readers will enjoy this if they missed in the hard copy of the N & R.

THANK YOU. ba

Joe,

I have thought more about the closed session on Grier's performance evaluation. Probably because it is a personnel matter, there are certain privacy issues. But once the list of measureable objectives have been established, surely they will share this with the public.

Sorry you were out of town for the last L O N G school board meeting. One of the new key words Alan used was "transparent" - that the SB is trying to be more "transparent". The public has been saying this for years. (If you go to this one, better take coffe and a comfortable pillow.)

I truly hope the list of objectives in the performance evaluation will be transparent to the public.

Numbersgame,

From my conversation today with Eric, you are correct.

The first map that was presented was for high schools only and to show the closest and second closet high schools as requested. Feeder patterns were not taken into consideration.

The second maps show elementary and middle schools and consider the feeder patterns.

It is not necessarily a "change" but another approach. The second would consider the closest elementary, middle and the resulting feeder patterns. As Bruce mentioned, all of these are preliminary. The problem is they REALLY are hard to read on line.

I would suggest to just call Eric and ask about your particular neighborhood and what happens to it on the "high school map" first presented; then what happens to your particular neighborhood when you consider feeder patterns of the elementary and middle schools.

The newest maps were supposed to take into effect feeder patterns, closest to school and capacity. What I found interesting was that many (not all) follow the current lines even when the students weren't at their closest school. If this is suppose to save money on gas (thought that was one reason) then why wouldn't every change possible be made. I can only speak for our area, but many weird things on the maps. one one side the closest kids go to another school, on the opposite side students are in one area that isn't the closest, so they counter balance. Not sure if that makes sense, but looks like take from the right, push from the left.

Another thing was that Jim Moen said he would have a hard time calculating costs for bussing. Didn't we buy some fancy program to help with routes, costs etc. I was very surprised by that statement. How does he make a budget proposal if he can't figure cost of transportation. He was then instructed to use today's gas cost to make that calculation and that everyone would realize that gas prices change!

Deb,

Excellent point about the cost of busing. I caught that too. This should be very easy to do with the fancy software and keeping the gas price the same. Actually gas is going down.

He should compare apples to apples and just include how many less gallons (or more gallons) of gas would be used and forget the actual cost per gallon.

Another very important consideration needs to be the TIME that these kids spend on the bus. If the schools are closer there is more time for homework, family dinners and outside interests and well needed sleep.

I just posted the Richard B. O'Neal guest editorial on the main Chalkboard page, Barbara Ann. I meant to do that this morning - sorry about the delay.

Not to interrupt this discussion - by all means, keep it going - but Mr. O'Neal had some interesting things to say and I thought you guys might like to weigh in.

Okay, I got an answer to the double maps - from Anita Sharpe herself.

She said the map was revised for the Nov. 8 meeting because the original map didn't meet all of the criteria she had asked for.

In particular, the first map didn't include feeder patterns (as numbersgame suggested) nor did it take into account when a school was filled up. On that map, for example, Page High School had more 2,400 students, which simply isn't workable. Economic diversity also is a consideration as defined in the original proposal, as long as it doesn't involve cross-county busing.

So the new map was revised by the central office staff to reflect those realities. And Anita said something I had mentioned earlier - these are just rough drafts, subject to review by the public and examination by the board. They're not set-in-stone attendance lines.

Hope this helps!

"Feeder patterns" is obviouSly going to be where the fudge factor comes into play here, it's going to be the "funk zone", that they must have to play this theIr way since 'feeder pattern' is a meaningless term that caN MEAN anything they want it to mean. THE SAME OLD SH...ah DUNG!!!!!!

Bruce,

Thanks for asking Anita directly. You appeal to the instant gratification side of me. Thanks for your speedy replies here on the Chalkboard. Seriously, you are very appreciated for all your leg-work...or finger-work, which-ever it may be.

Sweet Candyboy,

I hear ya on the fudge factor. Even a little chicken could see that they have to leave their messy prints on every map. It might look like fudge, but I can guarantee you it's something else not so sweet....ya know, that sh "it" plan showing thru.

Well, thanks. I'm glad I can be of service.

Sally,

On school calendars...the Option 2 that starts after Labor Day shows a REALLY short Spring Break. Looks like Winter Holiday might be shorter too. I would have to look again. Since we are now used to 8/25 (a great improvement of 8/11 two years in a row) my personal choice would be 8/25. Kid in sports have to come back in town earlier anyway.

You can click on the entire calendar layouts after you go the to SB meeting agendas and click on the memorandums attached under that item.

Why after all these years, they are even talking after Labor Day is beyond me. I thought last year some SB members didn't like the "late" start with 8/25 so I have no idea where the Sept. start option came from.

Forgot.

Compare green lines on Map 1 to map 2.

Bobs your uncle!

Forgot, the ravageees are NOT going to be people who have a sitting schoolboard rep to represent their interests, but then, you already knew that. When the maps come out and you get that feelin' that the shawdow on the wall isn't from the cat's scratch post in the corner, tell 'em the only way your gonna take it, is if socio-economic balance re-districting is done county-wide and not somehow confined to one out of 14 school districts in the county.

Again, in reference to the discrepancies in the maps, there was the first fudge factor: the ill-defined "feeder patterns" which I have yet to comphrehend what it means (maybe it's just me)then Anita made reference to "socio-economic balance" as defined in the original directive?? This, of course, is the ultimate Babe Ruth of fudge factors. What is socio-economic balance? How and by whom is it defined. Is it a percentage? If so, what percent? And who decides?
Obviously, the people in power decide, and the term means whatever they want it to mean. So we're back to square one. So why even do any of this?

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