News-Record.com

Re: The VSN program at Lincoln

Did I hear Deena Hayes say that she wants to get rid of this program all together because it is the equivalent of the slaves and the slave masters and that the two don't mingle very often?

Sometimes I can't tell if she hates whites or hates blacks.

Note to Deena: there are blacks in the program too!

Deena's comments are so ridiculous. I am so glad that the new board member spoke right after her and said, "Ouch." No one ever challenges her. She said she spent time with a Lincoln student who told her "all about the smart white kids." Is that a bad thing? Am I supposed to want my child to be a stupid white kid? There's not much I can do about her being white. Deena also made a comment (which she has made before) about how the parents at Wiley organized, even possibly with members of the faculty (oh the horror of it all, that any faculty members would think that things could be better if parents and teachers worked together) and now here we have middle class white parents organizing at Lincoln. Again, Deena, WHAT IS SO WRONG WITH ORGANIZING? Shall we all agree to be disorganized? No, it only OK when Deena can get the people she sees as HER CONSTITUENTS to organize. I think she is obviously bothered by the ease and effectiveness with which many of the VSN parents at Lincoln have orgainzed themselves. And she is so out of touch with the extent to which the students at Lincoln "intermix." By definition, only VSN students attend VSN core classes. There are black, white, yellow and brown students in VSN. There are black, white, yellow and brown students in Performing Arts. Get over it. There are those who will hold themselves serarate no matter what anybody does, and especially if people like Deena Hayes encourage hatred and mistrust of "the smart white kids." My daughter is in PE, Spanish and Band with all students. My daughter is on the student council with all students. I volunteer at the school on a weekly basis and I take care of the needs of ALL students. I will be at the dance this evening selling refreshments and talking to, encouraging and RESPECTING ALL the students. The fact that Deena Hayes chooses not to know this is her loss.

What got Deena in orbit was the implication by VSN parents that they do a better job of parenting than parents of African-American students.

Kevin Lear made a great presentation to the BOE on the Lucent vs Pod situation. It is now clear that the Lucent alternative would cost millions more and would not be ready to go in January. Everyone, except a few die hards at Eastern, see that Lucent will not work. I give the staff an A plus on informing the citizens of the true costs of the Lucent idea. Kevin Lear's group is overworked but they are good in getting the facts and in letting others spin their private agendas.

Jennifer,
VSN stands for Very STRONG Need, not "special". These children have been identified by GCS as having a strong need for differentiated services, not special services. We struggle on a daily basis with people (like Ms. Hayes) accusing us of considering our children more special than others. Unfortunately the passion that comes forth in our advocacy to maintain the service that they need so badly can be misinterpreted. Please do not add to that by misnaming the program in the paper.

Geez, it scares me that Deena Hayes makes decisions about the future of Guilford County's children. She clearly doesn't have the best interests of all kids at heart.

Her basic point about Lincoln - that kids in the various programs should interact more - may well be a valid one. However, there are so many better ways to express that than by comparing students to "slaves and slave masters"! Holding up the VSN students and parents as the bad guys isn't going to help Lincoln one bit.

In fact, getting rid of the VSN program at Lincoln would mean getting rid of active, caring parents like Michelle here. Does Deena really think that would help the school?

Kim,

VSN does stand for "Very Strong Needs." I apologize for the error in the post above. I'll correct it. I was typing up the online post while the meeting was still going on.

FYI: The story that appeared in the paper (and which is in the next post) used the correct term.

When Ms. Hayes said that only the white kids at Lincoln were smart, I was shocked and insulted on behalf of every kid, teacher, and family at Lincoln. There should be an uproar in the community about her arrogant and biased rantings. I know that if a white person had dared to insult our citizens of color the way Ms. Hayes did, it would not go unpunished... and rightly so!

I've seen many instances of both public ugliness and ignorance, but never in such a combined display. But it's my experience that the people with the fewest ideas and least to say often resort to name-calling and ad hominem attacks. It was interesting to me that the parents who spoke on behalf of their children and their children's education were told they should have watched what they said as it was hurtful, but apparently the same doesn't go for one of our elected officials. However, my grandmother used to point out that the braying of a jackass is ugly and unpleasant, but as with people one has to consider the source and move on. So, I will.

Joe,

I didn’t hear that “implication” from the VSN parents. I thought Deena’s comments were totally out of line as well as unprofessional. I only hope the young student who spoke so well during the comments section wasn’t around to hear Deena’s vitriolic response where she compared VSN students and their families to slave owners. If the student was present to hear this tirade, Ms. Hayes needs to do the right thing and apologize. Verbally beating up on a 12-13 year old says a lot more about Deena’s character than the VSN families.

Walter’s comment about the “fine” schools in High Point was way off the mark as well. Does the board not look at the passing rates for those schools? Here is the data from NC DPI: Percent passing EOG/EOC exams Andrews 42.1, Welborn 59.4! I would say this is anything but fine.

I agree that the Pod route is the most effective and cost efficient means to get the kids from Eastern back at one site next year. A colleague of mine has children in Forsyth County schools and says nothing but positive things about the Pod system.

Whatamess,

The student you refer to was there for the entire VSN portion of the meeting.

Deena Hayes comments were nothing less than DISGUSTING!

Deena Hayes HATES white people and the more she says/does, the more I want to be completely separate from her kind.

Surely SHE knows that slaves and slave masters intermixed.

Whatamess,

JWG is correct, the young lady was in attendance when Ms. Hayes went on her rampage. I agree that a public apology is in order. I can not believe that after the student spoke about the friends she not only had made in the VSN program but she had friends in all other groups as well, Deena compared her to a slave owner mingling with slaves. Ms. Hayes needs to take a long thoughtful time to reflect on this ugly public display toward a student and parents. As a board member she should remember that while she was elected from a particular district, she truly represents all families involved with GCS. It seems as if her anger over previous events has clouded any chance at meaningful discussions about improving all of the programs in GCS. An additional apology needs to come from Alan Duncan as well. As the chairman and moderator of the board meetings, he has a responsibility to ensure that people act in a respectful fashion, including board members themselves. There are tremendous problems facing the school board and only by getting everyone working together can they be overcome. A board member publicly belittling a twelve year old is not making progress.

BTB

A public apology would be appropriate. Resignation would be more correct.

I'm even more interested in the comment Deena made about the "white kid having to use the (so-called) 'black bathroom' at Wiley." What did she mean by that? I've got a blog entry planned on this by lunchtime today; please look for it, folks. I'll also have a response to the "welborn attacks" and I see Andrews has plenty of resources, according to principal Brooks. Not so, according to an inside source. Check my website blog around noon today, Thursday.

Her reference to all of these children as slave masters should bring an immediate end to her term on this board!!!

The administration did not use due diligence in investigating the Smith property. They made a huge mistake in believing the owners and not doing their own homework. It would be very embarrassing if they made this same mistake with Lucent. With a pod village the costs are more predictable.

Joe, it doesn't matter "what got Deena in orbit". She is an elected official who is supposed to represent ALL children not just black children. There is NO excuse acceptable for this type of behavior. It is an insult to every parent and student of every color at that school.

If the owners of the Carolina Corporate Center are going to give a guaranteed price the board should take another look at this option. Especially, if the guaranteed price is under 6 million dollars. It is rare that you would have enough space for 1100 students in an area such as this and if we have the total cost up front why would a responsible person not take a hard look at this option.

I have serious doubts about the cost of the PODS.
Last month when comparing the PODS to leasing the Carolina Corporate Center the PODS were around 3.5 million. This month the PODS are around 4.5 million and they still have not received a price and date from a builder.

Why do I have doubts? They are comparing these PODS to the school in Wake County. My understanding is that the "elementary school" which housed around 550 students cost $4.6 million dollars in 2004.

With Guilford County schools standard rate of inflation on construction projects of 1% a month, it would cost 5.75 million dollars to rebuild this "550" elementary student facility in 2006.

Eastern has around 1100 high school students so would the cost double since the number of students double? There was also talk at the last meeting about paying for an environmental study and re-modeling the vocational building. These costs are associated with this project, but I have not seen them included yet. Escavation, plumbing and sewer will have to be extended to the site where the PODS are to be placed.

What are the costs associated with this? Is this cost guaranteed?

If the cost is this close, then the outstanding issue is what can we get into the fastest. This
would be the existing building which already has sewer, plumbing, electrical, auditorium, and a cafeteria in place.

Our students would be in an enclosed, safe, secure
location and will have access to hot food in an excellent cafeteria facility. Parking for students, staff and buses will not be a concern and there are fields available for outside activities.

They will not have to carry or wear their coats in and out of every classroom and food will not have to be prepared off-site and brought in (cold) to eat.

Most importantly the Carolina Corporate Center can
be ready in August....there is serious doubt growing that the PODS can be ready in August and there is no where else for Eastern students to go!!!

If pods are not ready in August, the BOE should revisit the alternatives. Also, the need to have all four classes on one site is not as essential next year as it was for this year. Rising 9th graders would only choose classes given on their campus. It would work much better next year. I think having a Gym is worth more than having everyone on one site without a Gym. I may be wrong.

Joe,

You are wrong rising 9th graders. It is more important for these students to have access to advanced courses of study, band, chorus, foreign language, and computer classes than to have a gym.
They can have PE class outside in the fresh air.

My ninth grader benefited from taking courses along side of college bound juniors and seniors. If they are on a completely separate campus they will not be able to participate in band and chorus, this is currently one of our major problems with the current split campus scenario.

Qualified teachers are also at a premium. One of the reasons why we have teachers working from 9 - 6 on split campuses is so that 9th - 12th graders will have access to Spanish, Latin, and highly qualified English, history, Math and Science teachers. We have 9th grade students taking AP World History along side sophmores, juniors and seniors. Students taking this course were some of the most impacted after the fire and after the split. It's easy to say we will just hire more teachers...we are still waiting for an open Spanish teacher position. Qualified teachers are not coming out of the woodwork....... Ninth grade students are high school students...it is not a continuation of middle school. If they want to start a career tech path...these courses start in 9th grade and there is currently just one teacher per CTE course. Are you going to make them drive back and forth or hire more teachers? Where are these teachers going to come from?

By the time principals, new teachers, bus drivers, media specialists, SRO officers, custodians, cafeteria workers and counselors are hired for a split campus you could have put us in all three floors of the Carolina Corporate center!!!

Concerned

If the children will do better with all 4 grades together, then that we should try to do that. If the ninth grade is on a separate campus, there is no reason that some advanced class opportunities could not be offered. It is true that the only students would be ninth graders in these classes. Being able to use the vocational building on the Eastern campus means something. It is space we don't have to buy or lease. You have me worried, if the PODS are not ready for school opening, then they will be a monumental blunder.

Depending on the weather it is very feasible to have all the site work done once the POD placement has been established. The Lucent building would still have had to be renovated dividing up rooms, adding phone systems, alarm systems, HVAC adjustments, etc. This could take much longer than site work for PODs. The bottom line is there is more control over the costs of POD scenerio. As to minor things like providing a hot lunch, a nutritious lunch can be provided daily. Many students bring their lunches. All these details are workable.

The school administration should be given credit for trying to make a place work for all the students to be in one location by fall 2007. No answer is perfect but at least the school body will be together. Even if 9th graders have to be in another location that will work out too. There are many schools that offere grades 7 to 9 in one place and start high school in grade 10. The important thing is it will be better than having the current split and the various busing distances.

For an emegerncy situation I think the administration has done a great job in dealing with what they have been dealt. Think of the children in New Orleans. Some of the children still have no place to go to school.

The concern of all of the parents, especially the ones that see the Carolina Corporate center as the better option, is the fear that there is no way that the PODS will be ready by August. Secondly, these parents think that the total cost of the POD village will more than likely be in the $6-$8 million dollar range.

This is very close or higher than the estimated cost of a solid structure at the Carolina Corporate center.

It is very unusual for there to be a building such as the Carolina Corporate Center to have the space to house 1100 students after a tragedy such as this. They could have the students all together in a solid structure in a matter of months, yet Guilford County schools never even looked at it as a viable option.

As Kevin Lear said during the school board meeting, the school board never asked him to look at this option seriously.

Does he have to be asked by the Board to take this under serious consideration?

How did he come up with his dollar figures if he was never asked to look into this?

Does anyone on the board look at the numbers?

Why did they do an estimate of 150,000 square feet
at the Carolina Corporated center and compare the
cost of that to 95,000 square feet of PODS??
Of course, 150,000 feet is going to cost more than 95,000. The additional square footage may be in the vocational building, but they are planning on remodeling this for use.

How much is this going to cost?

Yes we are very anxious. If anyone in this county lived in our day to day life...they would be anxious too?

Precious time is passing for an August 2007 date.

The most important "PUBLIC AGENDA" is that we need somewhere for ALL of these students to attend school in August 2007.

The school board is backing our request and desire to be back together grades 9 - 12 on one site for
this we are extremely thankful.

Our only fear is if they stay on the path that they are currently taking we will not be together at the beginning of the next school year.

I will be more than happy to be wrong about this...

Concerned,

These are all excellent questions. Because of past school projects not being completed on time, you have every reason to be anxious.

If the true cost of the pods is more than the Lucent Building then you need to keep digging and asking questions why this site is not seriously being considered.

Could one reason be that the school system has a future interest in purchasing or leasing the Lucent Building for another use, for example, to move all administrative offices there to one location? And they want to protect that option? This is all conjecture.

If costs are truly lower for Lucent then you need to ask about scope of renovating and the time it would take.

Interesting about Leary. Since the administration had the initial go ahead from the board I would think that Leary would have to go to his superiors to look at the Lucent costs. Someone would have to direct him if there was a serious interest in the Lucent building. How did he come up with dollar figures if this wasn't a serious consideration or are the dollar figures not "serious" answers, just guesses? Good question.

Of more interest is the recent article in the New & Record where the owners of Lucent stand by their numbers and Leary mentions he made a mistake. Wasn't it in the millions? If so that is a "big" mistake in estimating.

DEENA HAYES IS A BLACK RACIST!

Deena is not a bigot.

She hates everyone equally.

Also she is certainly best dressed of the board.
Perhaps they should issue an award

She still needs to apologize for that series of comments, see my most recent blog entry and press release.

David,

What professional work does Ms. Hayes do to enable her to be the best-dressed on the board? Just curious.

Stormy, she can afford nice clothes after all that tax-payer money she made working for Skip at the Civil Rights Museum. Part of our money went to fund Deena's lifestyle.
But doesn't the half-white/half-black gurl look goooood??

It has taken me this long to control my emotions to reply to Deena Hayes insulting comments. Still my anger and disgust has not subsided over the holiday in light of the "spirit". I am an African American parent of an African American child in the VSN program. (Yes we do exist.) We consider ourselves fortunate and blessed that this program existed and my child was able to enter in Third grade before it became "illegal" to test second graders. We have been the AL route in our home school (where he was also the only black in AL and his class)and his needs were barely met for 30 minutes twice a week if even then as AL students rotated every few weeks. I challenge Deena Hayes to speak to my child and my family as she does not speak for me. To send my child back to his home school in Brown Summit he would still be a minority, and a child who is not being challanged or having his STRONG needs met. I grew up in Philadelphia in the 60's and to receive the education my child is receiving I had to attend a private school K-12 and at that time I was the only African American in my class. We were not wealthy but my parents made the sacrifice because they wanted the best education for me. I then chose to attend Bennett College,( a historically black womens college) so I have been on both sides and have had my foot in two worlds often at the same time. VSN is not a race issue and the parents of these students are only doing what any concientious parent in ANY school would do. Not to do so they would be remiss. I am an passionate advocate for my children and if you view that as being elitism or having a slave mentality. I question your mentality and your motive for being on the school board. My 5th grader in the VSN read your comments and I had to apologize for your insensitivity and explain to him that this is what he will encounter in the world even from his own race. I feel you owe him,the VSN community and,Guilford County a long overdue apology and your resignation. It seems you have lost sight of the reason you are on the school board. Your are entilted to your opinion but I want it known you do not speak for this African American family and again I challange you to meet with the the African American children and the parents in the VSN program. You may be suprised to learn we are on the same page with all the parents in that we want our children to receive the education they are due.
"If you stand for nothing you will fall for anything"