News-Record.com

I'll start us off. Many more of my comments regarding Deena can be found on my website.

But here's the thing...we're not in the 1950s or 1960s. This is modern-day Guilford County, 2007. What is so wrong with white students and black students mingling? That is what happens at many schools across this county on a daily basis.

Deena could have regained some credibility back if she would have started the meeting before public comments began by either apologizing if her comments were taken incorrectly, or maybe even clarifying her remarks. But she chose to wait until 11pm, giving what I would consider a rather "flippant" response.

Now Deena stands by her comments and I will stand by mine. I have a big problem when you have people like her who are in charge of policy and decision-making involving the lives of children of all races and taxpayer money from citizens of all races. And yes, this is a free country; in fact, this is the best country on the face of the earth, God bless America. And we're at war so that Deena can continue to express herself freely in such a biased manner.

But when you make such statements, and when you have a history of making such statements, don't think you are going to continue getting a free pass. Because there are people now who are ready to challenge those statements.

I'm a teacher and a father. All races of children walk through my door and I welcome all of them. As a father, I teach my daughter the value of respect and tolerance and diversity, but I will not teach her to act as though she's a victim or is owed something because of her skin color.

For what it's worth, I'm so sick and tired and angry of so-called elected officials constantly playing the race card in this county. It has got to stop.

As I said on my blog today, this is not City Council or the County Board where those kind of "show-antics" are a regular staple, this is the school board, representing the 3rd largest system in the state. Act as such.

I'm in full support of each speaker that spoke last night.

I'm also in full support of Carla Chambers and the EGHS family who still are fighting for the Lucent Building as a long-term option. I'm preparing remarks for the County Board as I speak.

I believe that Ms. Hayes was out of town and unable to be present at the start of the meeting. I'm not sure what time she arrived. Perhaps Morgan can verify this?

I am suprised Kris, Nancy, Garth and Amos jumped to Deena's defense. I believe in free speech but that does not mean you can hollow "fire" in crowed rooms. Deena seems to think that she does not have to be a role model for students, teachers and administrators. There is no question she has stirred up divison and confusion among both white and black citizens. Citizens should press on for an apology. The VSN should use every BOE meeting as an opportunity to get one. There is no question that her remarks violated the Civil Rights Act and also violated the spirit if not the words of her oath of office. Deena represents both white and black citizens of her district. Right now, the white citizens have no representation. The VSN parents do not have to take the racist remarks. They can tranfer their children to another school.

Well Deena says she didn't make the "Slavemaster/Slave" comment as it was taken a few weeks ago? It sure seemed that way on live TV when she said it. Plus the only major local news publication in the area sure reported it that way. OK fine, I'll let it drop if she can also explain a way this...

In that same meeting Deena made another comment about children complaining to her that a certain Elementary School had bathrooms for Blacks and certain bathrooms for Whites.

Is Deena going to call the child who spoke last night refuting her claim a liar? Or a racist? Or a Slavemaster? Or all of the above?

Garth,

What did you mean by "I wish the public
would learn restraint"?

I know you read and have posted on this blog.

JWG,
Hayes was present during the beginning of the meeting. She heard the comments. Typically, board members don't immediately respond to what people say during public comment. Sometimes they respond during the board comment period at the end of the meeting, which is what she did. However, I'm not sure if she would have said what she said without Joe Stafford's criticism about 15 minutes before.

What exactly did Joe Stafford say at the meeting?

He's always struck me as a straight shooter who speaks his mind, no matter who may agree or disagree. I've always respected that about Joe.

Garth is off to a bad start. For him to call for restraint from citizens who set for hours at the meetings but does not call for restraint from Deena is difficult to rationize. He seems to forget that his responsibility is to citizens and not to fellow Board Members.

ShameShame,

IMHO whether or not Ms. Hayes apologizes is irrevelant to the issue that brought the VSN parents before the BOE in the first place and, as a VSN parent, not a concern to me. Any continued calls for an apology from Ms. Hayes would come, not as VSN parents, but as a parents of GCS students and concerned members of the community.

My primary concern is with all VSN students and the continuation, improvement, and expansion of the VSN level of service for any student identified as a Very Strong Needs student.

By the way, we are not free to tansfer our children to another school as, at this point, there is only one school that offers the curriculum that GCS says is required by VSN students. One of the goals of the GCS Advanced Learners Plan (and encouraged by VSN parents) is increased participation at all levels of service, particularly VSN, and continued improvement of the program.

I do not agree with Mr. Quick's comments that Deena represents all children, at least if we consider the history of her comments in the past especially when it comes ot her constant rhetoric about minority contractors. Women contractors are not considered in her mind to be minorities.

Everyone does hae a right to freedom of speech and their personal opinion. The VSN parents had a right to respond to what seemed as personal comments/attacks about their "white superiority". The speaker who commented about reading to his child and being a "good" parent did seem to infer that others who do not read to their children are not good parents. Maybe some parents can't read BUT it does not make them bad parents. Most do the best with what they have to offer.

I do feel strongly that as an elected, PUBLIC official that it is Deena who should think of the parents she is offending before she speaks. It does not necessarily mean that other board members agree with her, but they do have to work with her as a peer on the same board. One alledged comment from a student about a bathroom does not make every white student "superior" or "racist". I get so tired of hearing over and over again about "white superiority".

It is true that putting a VSN program in a predominently black, stuggling school does create schools within a school. You have two extreme ends of the spectrum. There are bound to be "issues" if people of means are involved and other parents seem not to be involved. This is no different what is done at Central High School and the IB Program vs a Cooking Academy. All the talk about diversity is a joke. We have segregated schools within schools everywhere. On that I can agree with Deena.

I was the second to last speaker before Joe Stafford. I am a VSN parent who is a person of color and I waited until 10:45 pm to address the board concerning the remarks made by Deena Hayes. I made it clear that the situation at Lincoln was not a racial issue until Ms. Hayes played the race card. I did not expect an apology from Ms. Hayes I apologized to my 5th grade son for her insensitivty she displayed. She has not apologized yet I would not expect her to do so.

Mr. Herbert I agree that there is freedom of speech you stated Deena has the right to her own opinion. You also mentioned that is an honor to serve on a board with people who show great restraint. Ms. Hayes did not demonstrate restraint. You also stated you wish the public would show restraint. That is double talk. The board has freedom of speech but the public does not? That is a double standard. You also wished that the people who made the public comments were still at the meeting to hear you. Well we have heard and seen the final board comments. Why wait until the public had left to voice your support for Ms. Hayes? Why did she wait to give a sarcastic, defensive response? There has been ample time between December 19th and now.

Deena claims not to have directly called the VSN community slaves and slaves masters but to even elude to that reference is deragatory no matter how you try and spin it as a historical reference. History is not repeating itself at Lincoln.
Sorry Ms. Hayes you cannot begin to give me a person of color a product of the Philadelphia school system in the 60's and a Bennett College graduate ( a historically Black womens college here in Greensboro)a lesson on the history of slavery and think I do not recognize overt racism from one of my own.
Your claims of a black bathroom vs a white bathroom at Wiley are without merit as I stated last night there were clean bathrooms vs dirty as in most schools. You stand by your comments and I stand by mine. You lashed out at a 13 year old young lady and you want people to believe that you had those comments planned and already written down because why? You knew VSN was on the agenda? I believe you did not have to write down anything those words rolled off your tounge so easily because they are a part of your everyday vocabulary and mindset. You have issues you might want to check yourself on.
Wiley and Lincoln are different in that Lincoln also houses Perfoming Arts and Brooks Global. Why is VSN being singled out?
Finally Mr. Hebert wants parents to teach our children not to be offended when someone calls us a name. PLEASE! Our children are taught tolerance, turn the other cheek, sticks and stones etc... however I will not teach him/her to be a doormat or a stepping stone for someones own agenda. He will learn to stand for something so he will not fall for anything...with restraint of course.

You said "if you're called a racist, examine why". Where you speaking to the public or Ms. Hayes?

Om another note what relationship does the minority contractors for the Eastern School project have with Ms. Hayes?

Of course I think Deena was VERY wrong and she set a VERY bad example. In some ways what the VSN guy said the week before was a little conceited.

But the main victory last night that regardless of what Deena said it didnt turn out to be a commissioner meeting situation with everyone calling eachother names.

Lets move on.

The BOE only has itself to blame for putting VSN in to Wiley and Lincoln. What do you think the reason was for those choices? If you want to grow the school, locate it near where the vast majority of qualified children live. If that is Lincoln, then that is where it should be--- if it is Jesse Wharton, put it there, if it is Welborn, if it is Cone, if it is Stokesdale etc. The students will have less travel time, feel more like a community and perhaps there would not be the division that is perceived now.

BTW,
Well done last night Gwen and welcome to the forum. Since you live in Brown Summit, will your child be a Northern student, when the time comes? If so, welcome to our newly formed community!

Gwen, Welcome to the forum!!!

I have had MANY e-mails exchanges with Deena Hayes and believe me its a waste of time. Once we communicated on one subject over several e-mails and she finally stopped replying to me when I signed off with all the names she had called me in the excahnge. I ended it like this.
####
But who am I to know? I am only, ( as described by you in your several e-mails to me ) a childish, white male, laced with limitations, from a "clicky" white neighborhood with one token black friend.
####
So, take it from me. You cant win with her. Thats my advice to the VSN parents.

Thank you for your support, I do not intend to go back and forth with Ms. Hayes. I pick my battles and from the time she opened her mouth I knew we would never agree to diasgree. I needed her to see a person of color and let her know Game recognizes Game.
I also needed to advocate for the children she is elected to represent.
She speaks of privleged parents when she has been permitted the privilege to lash out at anyone without consequence.

She has no problem lashing out at anyone but she does has a problem advocating for the children she represents because she simply does not do it.

She will rant on about minority contracts ALL the time. Its very suspicious.

Gwen,

I listened to your speech twice. It was purely awesome! THANK YOU, THANK YOU for speaking out as a person of color from your prospective.

It is a shame that Ms. Hayes' comments, just like similar comments from a certain county commissioners, only create a racial divide.

You stated an interesting question about "Why is only VSN being singled out?" I have never heard Ms. Hayes refer to "all children". It is usually "my people or my children I am concerned with". One would like to think that every member on the school board is for all children and for education of all children and meeting the needs of all children, VSN included.

From Ms. Hayes' past comments her main agenda seems to be with minority contractors. She does not vote on many of the contracts awarded but has never said why she does not vote.(see past Rhinos for their opinion as to why). Guilford County should get out of the construction business, hand it over to private enterprise and leaseback buildings. Then there would be no personal agendas involved or perceived conflicts of interest. The school board needs to focus on the business of education. Based on Ms. Garrett's closing comments, our children are being failed by the system.

Back to VSN. These children are our future successful leaders who will make something of themselves in society. These programs should be encouraged and enhanced. These children should be rewarded for their efforts and sacrificing their time on cross town bus rides. They should be encouraged not looked down on.

To Eastern Parents:

Good Luck on trying to stop the Commissioners from handing over funds. They will play politics at first, give their little speeches, but in the end the GCS will get their funds. You will hear "we have nothing to do with school decisions, we just handle the funding". It is political. It is decided behind closed doors and multiple phone calls between commissioners, board members and the administration way before the actual Commissioners meeting. That is how the games is played.

Welcome to Reality 101 in Guilford County!

Hopefully the Pod Village will be done on time.

Gwen: Welcome as well. I saw your comments on the replay last night; you spoke very well. Thank you for your interest in all of our children, this is what my campaign for school board is all about. Please click on my name below, which will take you to my website to learn more about what we can do to take back our board from people like Hayes.

This whole "Deena" flap would seem to indicate that the administration and board's efforts to "diversify" the schools is a mistake. As I understand it, the placement of the VSN program at a predominantly poor and black school was to encourage mingling of white and black students. If Deena feels that this produces a sense of superiority and inferiority, then it would seem that the very objectives of diversity are not being met. Perhaps, this indicates it would be preferable to allow students to attend their neighborhood schools.

Stormy, You said the key phrase "If that is how Deena feels".Her feelings are not represnative of the VSN community.Many of these families have been in the program for 6 years or more, I have been in the program for three years. Do you honestly believe that a parent would leave their child in a program where they were subjected to raceism and hostility. It was not placed at Lincoln to encourage diversity or "Mingling". Remember Deena is opposed to "mingling".
Keep in mind Lincoln houses two other programs Brooks Global and Performing Arts they are diverse and mingling and noone is trying to disband them.
VSN was formed to address the children needs that could not be met in their neighborhood schools. Much in line with the people who choose to attend magnet schools or even home school. They are putting the welfare of their children first.
The VSN program is diverse and minorites are represented. If the program were removed Lincoln would still be diverse. I do not care if my child went to schooll with purple and green people as long as he is receiving the education he is due.
Finally before we went to Lincoln we met with school officials to ask if we would be welcome.This was done in light of the climate we endured at Wiley, and also because of the programs growth. We were met with open arms. In the past Denna has steered people to the VSN program. The same program she now wants to attack.

It sounds to me like Deena is trying to invent a racial conflict where none exists.

From comments made by Ms. Drummer and others, people are happy at Lincoln. Students and parents of various races get along just fine at the school. Isn't that what we all want?

Sadly, Deena would rather promote racial division than harmony.

This is just an afterthought. When Deena Hayes questioned children about Wiley. She claims they mentioned a black bathroom vs a white bathroom.
I have already commented on the fact that there were dirty and clean bathrooms as in any school.
One of the most blatent and disturbings things that we witnessed was the lack of books in the Media Center. The shelves were bare! Ms. Hayes here is a novel idea. Why not redirect your energy into obtaining books and supplies for children?

Sad but true, you just hit the nail on the head.
That is it in a nutshell.

She had only suceeded in making our bond stronger.
Harmony does exist. I do not look at the world though rose colored glasses. I know it is not perfect but why create a diversion where it does not exist?

Gwen, re books and media center for Deena.
That is a educational challenge and nothing to do with minority contracts.

She wont do it.

Truth, I know but Wiley is in her district...Lincoln is not. Just thought i would help her redirect her energy to do the job she was elected to do. One can only hope.

I just feel she has a very PERSONAL relationship with the minority contractors. That needs to be explored.

Your hero, Garth Hebert, the member who was gonna change the direction of education in our community, has turned out to be similar to a potted plant. I watched the Deena Hayes thing in December and quite honestly I was amused that no other Board member countered her rather inflammatory comment. After reading various comments by Mr. Hebert on this blog I would have thought he would have been indignant in reply to her statement in light of all the "injustices" that have been alleged to have fallen upon his constituency.

Or is it that Garth has realized he is only one voice among many and that in order to be effective he must work with Deena as well as the others in order to bring about change.

Are we witnessing Garth the Potted Plant, or has he morphed into Garth the Pragmatic One?

RP,

You do not know Garth. You do not understand Garth and apparently you never will. I believe what Garth was saying along with Amos, Nancy and Kris is that Deena personally is entitled to her opinion as it is "free speech", however, this does not necessarily reflect the opinion of the board as a whole. If you listen to the meeting again, he is saying if you are not a "racist" why worry about it. Basically, I took it that if people attack you unnecessarily and they are wrong, ignore it. Garth is still learning and things are not always what they seem.

Certain people have been trying to play that race card with North High Pointers for the past several years regarding redistricting. Guess what? IT DID NOT WORK. It was always about being bussed across town to a failing school, one of THE LOWEST in the state and one that is on a watch list.

If Garth or Amos or Nancy or whoever on the board started attacking what Deena's "opinion" (and remember it is just and "opinion" and a warped one at that. Paranoid people have opinons too and doctors treat their opinions with strong meds to get them back to reality) is Deena, in turn, could start attacking Garth's, Alan's, Nancy's "opinion". If they correct Deena it just gives her more attention that she apprently craves so badly.

I like how Darlene expressed her feelings on the matter in today's newspaper. She mentioned that Deena is entitled to her opinion but that board members should not be calling people names.

Why would any board member want to call parents names? The school board has enough other problems building a positive image, getting support for bonds, etc., they don't need to intentionally attack groups of parents and make them angry.

Gwen, the subject of "conflict of interest" with relation to Deena and her live-in partner has been brought up before. Even though she doesn't vote on certain contracts, she has never said why. You will notice that when Alan D does not vote for conflict of interest, he explains why.
Could it be because her spouse is involved in contruction, i.e., a family member.

Interesting to compare the N&R article on Deena Hayes to the one in the Rhino. The Rhino is quick to point out that NO Board Members agree with Deena Hayes, they only support her right to free speech.

The lead-in on this strand and today's N&R article are mis-leading. Deena Hayes does not have the support of the aforementioned School Board members in her beliefs; THEY ARE ONLY SUPPORTING HER RIGHT TO SAY IT.

So Realistic Parent, that kind of makes you the "potted plant" doesn't it?

As usual the N&R has engaged in an act of deception that has once again be cleaned up by the Rhino.

Amen everyone...amen

Allen Johnson on the N+R "Thinking out Loud" blog has come out in defense of Deena. I would not have expected anything less from the N+R and especially Allen "theMC" Johnson.

He thinks she was mis-interpreted.

Poor girl.

http://blog.news-record.com/staff/outloud/

In regards to the negative comments that have been posted about Wiley Elementary. I am speaking as a current staff member of Wiley and I would like to shine more positive light on the school for once. It is a shame the News-Record/other media continues to pour more and more negativity on Wiley. These students are working hard and are achieving goals that no one would ever imagine. Wiley is extremely concerned about their students and it is unfortunate that Wiley's name only comes up in the paper when things are bad. Things are great and they are turning into a marvelous situation day by day. We are improving and VSN is a part of Wiley's past, not the present. We have left that behind and we are moving forward to the next level.

Jennifer,
Is there any truth to the rumour that the Page principal has quit.

Apparently the Principal Terry Worrel has quit. He cant take working with Terry Grier anymore.

Thats the rumour on the street can you confirm?

Well, I first have to address the concerned Wiley teacher. Her concerns are valid and they do have merit. I will say that for the year my son was at Wiley there was "tension" and my son along with other
VSN children were subject to taunts just for being in the program. It just wasn't a good fit.I will say I was able to establish a good relationship with the office support staff and several of the teachers I encountered when I voluntered. I was always treated with respect and was greeted by name. The school was taking steps to improve their ayp scores by promoting tutoring and sponsering after school programs. Children were encouraged to read study and do their best. Sitting in the car rider line everyday the school annoucement ended by telling the children to remember to read!
The resentment from the then principal was evident in spite of our parental involvement. I had the pleasure of running into Mrs. Treadwell this summer and after two years she asked about my son and told me of the great things happening at Wiley.Including the improvement of test scores. I am happy to hear that is still the case.
On Mr.Hebert I was sitting at Lincoln waiting for my son to come out. I saw the channel 12 news van.Its amazing they only aired one parent who said "It's time to move on" but the real surprise was how quickly Mr. Hebert did a complete 360 and said Deena violated GCS policy because her statements included reference to race. Any such statements related to race, religion, creed, color etc. are prohibited. And how is it she can say something that is in violation of the same policies the School system expects everyone from Dr.Grier down to students to follow? Per the handbook there would be repercussions for our students or anyone in violation. Now he is backpedaling since the media is on to him he may now realize it is not best to align himself with Ms. Hayes TOO LATE! After watvhing him Tues at the boe meeting he need to sit back and consider this on the job training. He actually voted on something and then later admitted he was ignorant of the all the facts! But it still would not chage his vote. How could he not know she was violating a GSC policy and defend her right to free speech? Will she be held accountable? Will She respond to telephone calls? She can not claim she made those remarks in the heat of the moment as she has admitted she thought about what ahe was going to say. AND she meant what she said. Will she finally be held to the same standard?
Allen Johnson I have to sleep on that one..My children are young 8 and 10 so all this is still new to me..the school issues I have dealt with before were minor and could be handled quickly so I am learning..Thank you all for being so candid and informative....I paln to stay on my game and in touch...
Thanks for clarification on the contact issue..It was mentioned at the meeting to me by a Eastern guilford school parent..They thought she had a live in partner involved in construction and the contracts...Well goodnight all. Have to get ready for tomorrow to put my 3rd grader on a 6:45 am bus to go to a school less than 5 miles away..
How can you move on when someone is trying to hold you back?

Dear NewsAlert,

Terry Worrel is a "she" not a "he".

And I believe all this Deena stuff is way out of control. If you read the transcripts, (I can email it to you if you do not have it) you will see that, taken in context and viewed as a whole, Deena WAS referring to a historical contextual reference point to communicate that just because blacks and whites are in close proximity does not mean that the relationship is rich, dynamic and the best that we can offer ourselves or our community.

I realize that many view Deena in a particular way. She IS the voice of the black cause. So what is wrong with that? She is black. Doesn't that line up? Do we not have parents who clearly advocate for EC kids because they have an EC child? Yes. I know that Deena has often been a polarizing and provocative voice on the board. So it is understandable that folks view her through that lense as a knee jerk response.

But if you really read through this particular exchange, and let it stand alone, and do not project your past biases or opinions on this in regard to Deena's agenda... she was responding to the comment made about a VSN program being placed always at a majority POOR and BLACK school. She stated that this particular population is vulnerable and often exploited.

Come on folks. That is true.

She also mentioned that if you are going to combine affluent white, and poor black students, you need to have some expertise in doing so. Is that a ridiculous request? Don't you think that is true?

I do not believe that Deena's threat to kill the VSN program has anything to do with this particular exchange.

I would not kill the VSN program. That makes no sense. It is just as harmful to let a child who is 2 grade levels ahead sit bored in a classroom as it is to let a child who is 2 grade levels behind sit bored because she cannot keep up. We are supposed to meet the needs of all children, so we must provide intervention for the students who are behind, and we then MUST equally provide for the students who are ahead.

I believe that all this upset is because Deena used the words "slave" and "slave master". Obviously people around here freak out, stop breathing, and shut down cognitive functioning when those words are spoken in public.

Really, look at the context to which these statements were made. Get over your emotional reaction to those words, and look for the message and the meaning that Deena was expressing.

I do not believe that Deena was making racist/harmful/hurtful statements. (Okay, sometimes she does that, but let's just look at this time on its own merit.) She never called anyone a slave or a slave master. She was making an analogy to the fact that because blacks and whites are in close proximity does not mean there is a rich exchange or meaningful relationship in place. She was using history as a reference point, and obviously people here are not at peace and have not reconciled the truth of the past. What Deena said was true in the past. She did not say it is true now.

Come on. Really put your bias, your judgements of Deena in the past, and your reaction to the words "slave" and "slave master" in perspective.

Deena was not making a racist comment. She was communicating a thought and a reference point for discussion.

This whole thing is much ado about something misunderstood.

VOTE NO ON SCHOOL BONDS

Kearns / Grier/ Hayes

THE WACKOS MUST GO----OR NO DOUGH

Terrina,

We have take this in the context of the educational environment. I expect Deena to be a role model and a leader in bringing us together. What is most distressing is that she want say "I did not mean to offend anyone" or I should have made the point using alternative language". Deena, in line with other BOE members never admits mistakes. This should be a learning experience for all. I am not sure it has.

Terrina,

If Deena is the "voice of the black cause", then who on the board is the voice of the middle class?

You said "we are supposed to meet the needs of all students" - what about those kids in the middle? What about those high achieving kids who aren't in VSN?? Dr. Zhang has stated many, many times that if the achievement gap is closing it's because the lower performers are moving up and the high performers remain stagnant or drop.

What about them??????

Terrina,

Deena has one agenda only and that's to represent the Black community and not our community as a whole. And in order to represent that community she must continually place the race card as well as appear to stand up to the White man in order to maintain her Black support. I can empathize with her on some issues, but her sole intent is to be a dvisive voice on the Board and to play the race card when it is expedient for her agenda. She comes from the same cloth as many Black activists and that is to holler racism when things aren't going according to their agenda.

You may be naive, but I'm not. Deena's purpose in using that term was simply to use the race card in order to cow any disagreement toward her viewpoints. And quite frankly, it worked, and worked well against who we thought was going to be the savior of the NHP crowd and thus the educational integrity of Guilford County as a whole, Potted Plant Garth Hebert or is it Pragmatic Garth Hebert.

By the way, why doesn't Garth engage us in talk on the CB as he did prior to many of us voting him in? Has he forsaken his constituency?

RP,

I don't see any other school board members commenting on the CB (at least under their real name)so why should Garth be comment here. It is not the right place for a school board forum.

The NHP crowd learned their lesson long ago about Deena's only agenda (post ABC days). As for Garth, we supported him, we worked for him, we stood in the rain for him,we had many people vote for him. We know him and we stand by him and we trust him. We are so proud of him representing District 2 and looking out for ALL children.

Why are you still so jealous that Garth has won? Is it because you have lost a previous election? I think you need to move on.

Terrina,

There is nothing wrong with Deena doing any of these things as a parent or a citizen...but NOT as a school board member who took an oath to help all children.

I know that being biracial causes her to have some issues but she can't continue to take it out on the white kids in Guilford County.

Nobody is perfect. I know Garth every well. He is a VERY good man.

He will make mistakes but he will learn, please dont take the bait and turn this against him. Gwen, dont forget that he was, if I remember, a strong supporter of keeping your program at Lincoln.

Associated Press has picked up the story. It is on the N&O website. Deena has got to stop this by saying "I used a poor choice of words" or something.

In reference to Garth after seeing him on the news The first time he stated she was in violation of the GCS handbook. It is on page 22 rule 8 which refers to insulting, Disrespeectful words and a host of other ACTS...she touched on almost all the actions in the paragraph her favorite being demeaning, degrading. insulting, socioeconomic status, parental status and others...the handbook is acessable at the GCS website but it seems to govern student behaviour...also on channel 12 this morning another part of yesterdays interview aired and if I heard correctly Garth said Deena should apologize and not to do would be remiss..I give him much credit for taking that stance. I also notice that when he made an error or did not know all the facts he admitted it. I understand he has to learn his way around and appreciate the stance he took yesterday.
Terrina, Are you serious? Deena should be the voice of all children. You may consider her the voice of the black cause but she is not voice I want to represent my children, SHE constantly makes reference to POOR and BLACK as if they always go hand in hand.She exploits the schools she is elected to represent. If she continues to represent "her children" in that matter I would not be surprised if the children didn't develop self esteem issues, or the same brashment that she displays. My family is not poor and certainly not wealthy by any means. I have a VSN child and a EC child. I advocate for both as I would any child.
Combining students such as a white affluent and poor blacks needs to be done with expertise? That make up of students exists in many schools and magnet programs. VSN is a diverse group with different economic status and minorities none of which come into play because the parents and the students all recognize they all are there for the same purpose. To be educated. Expertise? The program has been in existence over 10 years and has grown in numbers, evidently it is working,even with the black and white students in close proximity. To observe the children together in harmony is amazing. There are rich and meaningful realtionships. And the children are able to take advantage of other classes outside of their core classes. Remember Performing Arts is housed there as well as Brooks Global. Performing Arts is housed in a school without an auditorium. That should be a concern.
If she was communicating a thought and a reference point for discussion( which I doubt) she could easily chosen another another analogy.(like oil and water) they don't mix. She certainly had the time as she indicated she had already composed her thoughts and written them down."She knew what she was going to say" She has suceeded in creating a dicussion but not a division in the VSN community.
This is not the first time she has bashed VSN there are transcipts dating from 1995 so it won't be the last. I have counted at least four times where you have you the words "I believe" and you want us to believe she is misunderstood. I believe you are misinformed.
She used the history of slavery as a reference point evidently she is not at peace and has not reconciled the truth of her past. Maybe it the biracial thing that has her so angry that she spits venom. Which part of her makeup bothers her? Is that why she discourages mingling? She should check that.

Why would Garth take the bait and post on here in response to Realistic Parent?

Realistic Parent is a Figment of the Imagination. He is not posting under his real name so who would Garth be responding to?

Wiley had a bad rep without the VSN parents. We all read in the newspapers a few years ago where dead bodies were found in the woods near the playground. This had nothing to do with VSN. Blame the news for the stories that they choose to report or misreport.

Joe

what is the N & O website?

Raleigh News & Observer

Why are you still so jealous that Garth has won? Is it because you have lost a previous election? I think you need to move on.
__________________

Man, is there some irony in that statement!

I'm somewhat new to the Greensboro area and learning how to be an advocate for my children. That is because I have never HAD to be an advocate for my children in the other two cities in which we have lived. I was at the 12/19 meeting, my first ever BOE meeting, and I will tell you that no transcript and no TV viewing can capture the hate and malice that Ms. Hayes's words injected into that room. It was startling. It was unprofessional. It was intentional. And the "historical reference" excuse is simply that... an attempt to cover up a blatant, emotionally charged racial slur. No one who was actually there would say that Ms. Hayes's rant was a premeditated lecture using historical references to logically illustrate a point. Being there is the only context in which her comments can be accurately viewed.

TERRINA GO DIRECTLY TO ALLEN J'S BLOG SITE. DO NOT PASS GO. DO NOT COLLECT $200.00. DO NOT STOP TO COLLECT ANY MINORITY CONTRACT MONEY.

POSTS ARE WAITING THERE FOR YOU.

PYE 210,

I hear you. I witnessed the same venom at the Smith Sadium forum of winter 2003. You could not only see the hatred in her eyes when speakers started to speak, you could feel it. Many others witness the same.

Hi Everyone,

I left a ridiculously long response to all the questions posed to me on Allen Johnson's blog. Please see my response to your comments there.

Pye 210,

Welcome to the Jungle, we've got racial games
Some schoolboard reps who will steal your kids,
won't bother learning their names.

If they got the right kind of skin, and can help them with their scams.
Doesn't matter what the parents think, if your kids are part of their plans

Jungle, Welcome to the jungle
Mama, mama, mama, mama, mammaaaa

Welcome to the jungle, we got No-bid contracts.
If you got the right kind of skin, mama you gonna get fat.

But you've been held down for years,
so mama come get what you've been missin'
Time to go to the well once more
A new bond in 2007.

Jungle, welcome to the Jungle.
Maamammammammaaaaaaaaaammmaaa

Welcome to the Jungle,
schools are falling down.
Inmates running the asylum,
teachers leaving town

But the contracts been extended,
Everything is fine.
Private schools are filling up
You better get in line.

Jungle, welcome to the Jungle
Mamamammammammammaaaa...........

Terrina,
"It's Mr. Spaulding"(on Allen's site) you corrected Terry.
The questions posed to you were rhetorical. As much as I hated to I went to Allen Johnsons' site...Why would you answer our "questions" on his site? And your first blog was almost identical to your blog here. Did you think you would receive a different reception? You didn't. Aside from Allen and Jim Langer, so I guess that is where you will spin. I agree you posted a "RIDICULOUS" sorry "ridiculously long response."
You were called on the way you spin your comments and your response was "That is fun". Which is why I questioned your sincerity. Ralph Waldo Emerson? That is really reaching. And comparing Deena to an attorney who specializes, that is as lame as her analogy that sparked this discussion. Yes, they both take an oath however she took one to represent all children not just black children. Oh and your "let's not get stuck in details of an exchange". An exchange is comprised of details. You say you know Deena and you do not believe (there is that word again) she is making racist or deragatory statements against anyone. Have you spoken to her? The media has been unable to reach her as she is out of town for a few days. Prehaps you can call her and clarify her remarks for us. You support Deena and VSN as the two are not "mutually exclusive in this situation. Wrong again, they are inclusive how can you seperate the two? That is what this is all about. Ok I'll give you this one to answer. If the Deena you know is such an advocate for black people why is she not advocating to have more minorites in VSN? Are you Deena?
If you decide to spin us an answer would you please give us the courtesy of a reply in this forum? Please. Thank You.

YOU GO GWEN! GREAT RESPONSE. This discussion is anything but "fun", it is serious business. It is not funny that people have to beg to have a proper education for their children.

Gwen do you understand the reason, or should I say the "real reason" for the audit? Is it just to see if the ratio of minorities is "right"? And if not to disband the program?

That would be so wrong. The only reason for an audit should be how can we improve the program, offer more courses, involve more teachers and let more bright children and parents know that the program is there for them.

Hi Gwen,

I cetainly did not mean to make light of the seriousness of any of this. I was responding to the post of voting on my spin of the Deena matter versus Alan's. (A light moment in all this heaviness.)

I apologize if you were offended by that.

And sorry I responded to the wrong person.

I think this is all terrible. I think it is terrible that we, as parents, have to be constantly in a state of upset, and it seems we are always in a position of fighting for a decent education for our children in Guilford County.

I have never lived anywhere like this. My three children were all born in a different state and there was not a school system like this mess in any of the places I have lived before.

None of this is fun, and I would not want to make light of any of this.

We are talking about matters that affect the quality of our children's lives, and the quality of their future. There isn't anything more important than the education of our children.

That is why I am very tolerant of upset on this forum. When you are messing with the education of someone's child... it is understandable that parents get upset.

I only posted on the other blog because someone on THIS blog asked me to look at the OTHER blog and respond. I know there are people who read both blogs, and I just could not post my thoughts on both. I imagine there are MANY people who don't care at all what I think, so I didn't want to expose people to my thoughts twice.

Again, I understand why we all get upset with all this stuff, but I hope we can all stand together as parents, and be understanding of each other's point of view. I am sure parents who do not have a VSN child don't have any idea of the issues that are going on with that program. Although I do not have a VSN child, I am certainly aware that we have to have a program for students who are academically gifted. I will advocate for a good VSN program because I COULD have a child that would need that service, and I would want it to be a healthy, challenging, well run program. If we have the program, it might as well be a good program. To the extent that the VSN program is chaotic or not good enough, I think the whole district suffers.

Terrina,

I know that you know that "divide and conquer" has always been a very successful strategy for Grier and the board. Perhaps the other districts that you've lived in had not yet caught on to that idea.

It works really well here. If the board always pits neighbor against neighbor and parent against parent, then there is never county-wide consensus from any one single parent group. Dot continues to win elections this way.

Jim Kirkpatrick would have been an incredible addition to the board of education in 2004. He would have brought about significant improvement to our entire school system and to ALL students.

Instead, Dot spun the ABC group who campaigned for him as wealthy white winey parents (even though none of those 3 adjectives are accurate). This caused much of the rest of the county to "dislike" these North High Point families and thus they voted for Dot.

Similarly, this VSN controversy has somehow painted those parents as begin white elitist racists. We all know this isn't true, but that's the spin.

Let's all get smart and come together - parents from all across the county and let's jointly agree on candidates for 2008. Let's all work together to elect GREAT board members so we can finally get back to education.

Within the boundaries of having children attending GCS, what would qualify as being "elitist"?

Is it true that Walter Childs has asked for diversity numbers on the VSN program? If so then VSN parents beware. YOU think you are diverse. In the eyes of Dot Kearns and Co you are not.

You had better be prepared to do battle.
I have seen this film before.

Truth,

Dr. Childs made a motion to request an "independent audit of the effectiveness of the VSN program including costs". By the time the motion was actually voted on, it had morphed into "an internal study" (see the GCSNC.com BOE page for the approved meeting minutes) to be conducted by Dr. Zhang.

Whenever the VSN level of service is mentioned, a request is made for "a breakdown by ethnicity" (Ms. Hayes made such a request at the BOE retreat on 9/23/06 according to the minutes of that meeting).

The BOE developed and approved a Plan for Advanced Learners (PAL) as required under NC General Statute 115C section 9B in 1998. The plan is updated and reapproved by the BOE every three years. The PAL provides the BOE approved framework for GCS to implement and administer AL services for AIG students (about 15% of the GCS enrollment) at Moderate, Strong, and Very Stong Needs levels. The PAL was last modified, approved, and submitted to the NCDPI by the BOE in April 2005 (second grade testing and VSN services for third graders were eliminated).

The extent that any level of AL service is "diverse" likely reflects the socioeconomic realities of Guilford County (see "Analysis: Wealth plays a strong role in school success" News&Record 10/5/2005).

The extent to which AL services are effective is likely a direct result of the GCS administration's implementation and administration of the BOE approved PAL.

Thanks for the heads up!

Hello folks. Look at my website blog entry for Jan. 15, click on my name below to take you directly to my website. Let's use her remarks as an opportunity for all of us to refocus and redouble our efforts to put children first.

E.C. Huey

FYI – News 12 Interview

I shall not talk to the press, I shall not talk to the press, I shall not talk to the press…

What was not aired…

First, “Deena has a right to free speech and beliefs and I will defend her rights”. This is first and foremost.

Second, I said it was “time to grow up and move on. I did not like what she said, how she said it, or any interpretation of the content it may have been construed to apply to, it was plain and simply derogatory, but she has a right to say it!”

Third, after several parents complained that our children would not be allowed to say such a thing I looked it up in the hand book that all parents have to sign a form saying they have read, and any reasonable person can interpret them to read as an improper remark within the guidelines. In this regard I agree on the technicality that a written transcript shows that she did not call those parents “slave masters”, however, as one pointed out, having been there, heard it and the communication of these remarks, it was seriously derogatory in nature and the “attack” on these parents was uncalled for. However, it was her “right”. Having been offended herself, maturity would have suggested restraint in her use of such inflammatory language.

Fourth, in the unaired portion of the interview, I suggested an apology should be given to allow us, as a Board to put this behind us. Unaired - I also stated that is her right not to and I will stand by her decision. I also stated that I do not believe she could sit in a disciplinary hearing on the issues of derogatory language as I believe she has disqualified herself.

Not said, I believe the Board now has a tenuous position in holding any child accountable for such remarks. Judging by the behaviors I have seen in our classrooms and hallways I doubt this is really an issue today anyways. With the prevalence of gangs and other serious disciplinary issues (at one of the schools I visited last week I listened to a shouting match, complete with obscenities between a teacher and a student during class time in class) I can long for the days when such things are disciplined.

Lastly, because my most repeated comment to the press was we should put this behind us was never aired and I must emphasize again, this is most important. My 360 was not, except, in that our students have a right to good role models and an adherence to the student guidebook should be exemplified by the Board of Education membership. In that regard I suggested the apology.

I will not talk to the press. I will not talk to the press. I will not…

Sorry, too much was edited out to promote a fight between Deena and myself that will not happen. There are much more serious issues to attend to.

To those of you kind enough to say I am still learning, I give you the understated writers of the year award! I feel like an anteater at a fourth of July picnic.

Dear Ant-eater,

Good for you. At least you are brave enough to run for a board position, and courageous enough to sit up there and keep up with the complexity of what is going on all the time. You get credit for giving up such a huge chunk of your personal time for the benefit of the kids.

No harm, no foul.

Garth,

We elected you. We trust you and stand by you. We have your back. We are all works in progress and still learning. We just do our best in the best way we know how.

Keep up the good fight!

Back to the orginal subject of the VSN program.....

There was an excellent letter in the High Point Enterprises today from a student at Welborn. She said what many of us have been saying that there needs to be a VSN program in High Point and that Welborn would make an excellent location. Many of us have been saying for several years that more students from High Point would join the VSN program if they had one closer to home. The writer also states this.

The writer also called attention to the fact that Welborn is being talked about in a negative way and that she loves her school.

As the program grows in numbers and available teachers, Welborn should definitely be a consideration.

Does anyone know how many students that qualify for VSN choose not to go? Also, where are they located. I know of 4 in the current 8th grade that qualified, but chose to stay in neighborhood schools, mostly due to length of bus ride.
I thought Garth was right on, when he said the school should be located near the most students that qualify. Of course that would be a floating place as numbers would constantly change.

Not one speaker at either board of education meeting said ANYTHING against Welborn. It was Dot Kearns who SAID that "people are saying" negative things about Welborn. Her tirade at the December meeting did NOT reflect any of the public comments. This whole response from VSN parents has to do with continuity at Lincoln, programming at Lincoln, and the friendships that these children have developed at Lincoln. Furthermore, VSN needs to be better staffed PRIOR to opening a duplicate.

All I have is my experience: AL (I have one VSN child and one AL child in a districted school) is MORE WORK. My VSN child has project upon project that takes tons of resources ($) and time. It is not an acceleration, which I think it SHOULD be. My AL child in the districted school has more work, but it's not NEARLY as bad as it was for my older child prior to entering VSN. During that time, AL was in addition to classwork, and it was a ton of work that didn't expand understanding. It was all about quantity, not quality. My child experienced a "VSN-like" program in another state which WAS about acceleration and depth of knowledge. GCS VSN doesn't compare.

If you look at a map of where the VSN students come from, the majority of the students are from the Northwest region of the county. However, Lincoln is nearly at the geographic center of Guilford County. In my opinion, Lincoln is a great choice, and we like it there because of the programming and the diversity!!!

NC Transplant,

You may like it there and that is great. However, there are students in High Point who want a VSN program but do not want to be on a long bus ride. This has been the feeling of many High Point parents with children of strong needs for many years. Some of these same children are now excelling in the Early College Program at Guilford.

Once the program is stronger there needs to be one in High Point.

Northwest does not have an EXCLUSIVE on smart kids that need to be challenged. The program's (s') needs to be lucrative for ALL students and closer to their homes.

Come on, the VSN is NOT diverse. Its exclusive to middle class kids and mainly white.

One more thing. Isnt it the same distance for NW kids as for HP kids? I dont understand the difference. If we want one in HP then we will need one in each of the four corners of the County.
Lincoln is in the center so if you dont want to go there from HP then tough titty.

Debora,

At the start of 2006/07, I believe that there were 273 kids enrolled in the Academy at Lincoln 4-8 grade VSN program out of 327 eligible students. That number is now down somewhat due to some students leaving the program. 54 eligible students chose not to attend.

Maps showing the distribution of eligible kids are at the Lincoln web site under the VSN link.

You're right, NC Transplant, the vast majority of parental opposition to Welborn as a site for a second VSN program was not based on the school itself. If you recall, Welborn was not the only school suggested for the second site and the arguments against the split were the same under every scenario.

The parental opposition was based on the questionable numbers analysis and the fact that the plan as presented was doomed to failure. Why? The basic but critical success factors were missing from the proposed plan. Those included having enough qualified and experienced teachers, enough kids in each grade (especially the elementary grades in a middle school) to replicate the current learning environment at Lincoln, enough kids in total that the program is significant to the school community and administration, and finally an administration that can effectively support diverse programs within a single school. Lincoln meets all those criteria. Splitting the program as originally proposed would not only have weakened the Lincoln program but would have ensured that the launch of the second program, WHEREVER it was, would have been far less than successful.

As a parent of kids who benefit from gifted education, I would never want to deny it to other kids in the same situation. And, having said that, if the current VSN program were picked up intact and moved to any other school in this county (assuming the success criteria were met), I would make sure my kids got there no matter how long the bus ride. They're on the bus 1.5 hours to Lincoln already. But a split VSN program hastily created and based on bad math would not be a solution for any kid in this county. The kids currently being served would be robbed of a successful educational experience they can't get anywhere else-- NW or HP, public or private-- and the new kids would be getting a mere shadow of the program they hoped to replicate.

I would love to see the VSN program expand so that any kid who needs this type of program has easy access to it. But expansion has to be done thoughtfully and intelligently or the new diluted VSN programs won't be worth driving down the block to attend.

I DO live in High Point. My child IS in the VSN. She has a 45 minute bus ride each way.

pye210,

Your observations about the questonnable ability of GCS to establish a successful second VSN program apply to every new program that this district decides to implement. All of them are hastily approved, with little to no planning, nor do they ensur that there is teaching or administrative staff to support it. Sadly, this is status quo in this district in the Terry Grier Era. The style is to throw something against the wall and spend a lot of money. If it doesn't work (which is normally the case), then disband it. Face it, Tery Grier has to justify his title as Dr. Innovation. Millions of tax dolars are no limit. It's just your money.

NW Not and VSN in HP,

My family lives in High Point and when our child qualified for the VSN program we had a choice to make and together we weighed the transportation issue (long bus ride) versus the educational needs of our child. We choose the VSN program at Lincoln and have not regretted it for one second. I know of a couple of families (also in High Point) that choose not to send their child to Lincoln not because of the bus ride but rather they didn’t want to leave their friends. As jwg points out there are 54 kids who were eligible for VSN but choose not to partake in the VSN program, this translates to around 11 kids per grade (4-8). Even if all theses kids are from High Point, and we know they are not, it still doesn’t necessitate starting a new High Point VSN program. NC Transplant didn’t say all of the VSN kids come from NW Guilford county just that the current, and based on housing construction, future demographics would warrant a long hard look at that area of Guilford county for a second VSN site. As I posted on Hogg’s Blog, in a unified school district we need to stop duplicating programs in High Point because a program exists in Greensboro. Programs should exits because of a need and the demographics must support that need. Furthermore, someone in the school system had a brilliant idea when they reopened Lincoln upon completion of the renovations to house the VSN program along with the performing arts and global studies magnets in addition to the neighborhood kids. That way all of the students and their families feel a sense of belonging and no group is considered the outsiders. This should be studied and carefully emulated when the need truly arises rather than a hasty split of the VSN program.

Biotekboy