News-Record.com

"... the mysterious skirt around the fact that capitalist societies depend on low-wage level work.."

Interesting comment, Morgan, but could you provide some docummentation for it? It would seem that communistic and socialistic societies depend moreso upon it, taking China as an example.

Stormy,
I don't have any reports on hand but slavery, migrant farm labor, pre-union factory work and now, outsourcing to third world countries (with their wages relative to ours), come to mind.

What I mean by skirt around is that in these economic reports the facts about how our economy works are not addressed (well, I did see one that put America on the top of a global economic pyramid). Instead, the argument made is that every American (and America too!) would be better off financially if he/she had a high school diploma. That is only relatively true. For example, is a high school drop out who lives with family/friends and rides the bus to work but is able to save money worse off than a young professional living paycheck to paycheck for a decade because of college debt? Depends on your perspective and yardstick.

And the educated politicians who bomb a city across the world versus the drop-outs wrapped up in an inner-city gang turf war: who was failed more by the educational system? Again, perspective.

Of course, now Americans are finding that it's hard to find or keep many jobs even with a bachelor's degree, which could be a knowledge issue, but just as likely a job shortage issue.

I just take these reports with a grain of salt, is all I'm saying.

Morgan,

Wow - it looks like you've ventured off into an op-ed here.

Education is good for everyone. Period. It has been shown that the more educated the parents are, the better their children will perform in school. Even if education is not required for the parents' jobs, it would be essential in encouraging their children and their children's children to gain additional knowledge, education, and hopefully higher paying jobs.

Knowledge is power and that most easily occurs with education.

Also, education would more easily allow those whose jobs don't necessarily require it to move ahead and be promoted within their own work environment. Otherwise the low wage earners are in a dead-end situation.

Morgan,

Your response leaves me speechless. I thought that this was a blog to discuss educatonal issues, rather than politics of economic systems. Honestly, I'm not even sure what your argument is above.

Morgan, you'll need to take up this issue of migrant farm labor and low paying jobs with Dot Kearns. Dot likes to point out that her career as a social worker in the 60's helped many peanut farmers from Georgia move to High Point for a career in the hosiery mills of High Point; and I doubt these were management trainee positions and I doubt the hosiery mills in High Point in the 60's had Union representation.

I only know these facts because Dot used them in a speech before the School Board at about 10:20PM on 2/10/04.

So go see Dot, she knows how to work the system for benefit of a few at the expense of many.

My comments on education froma different topic.

I have just sent this to the school board.
Bet I get no answer
Ok

Mission Possible, Aviation Academy, Culinary Academy, Engineering Acadamy, Health/Medical Academy Performing Arts Academy, Two year GTCC scholarship. Discipline Task Force, Advance placement Courses ( some with less than 10% passing ) Striving Achieving Excelling,( Business spent half a million dollars telling the world )
Low drop out Award, Thematic Goals, New Mission Statement, Core Values

Can we get some perspective and finish something?

Well over 30 percent never graduate.

Many that do cannot be considered literate in the 21st century
They read write and do arithmetic at an abysmal level.

We fiddle with awards, end of grade statistics, guide lines. No Child Left Behind.
Fancy misleading names for programs. You name it.
They cannot read write and do arithmetic.

GTCC’s largest division is Developmental. That is a Euphemism for Remedial.

I would challenge every member of the School Board. This fall to go spend a few days at GTCC in the Developmental Division. Talk to the administrators, full time faculty etc.
Look at English and Math 050,060,070. Just go look. Read the Text Books, take the placement exams yourself ( you might learn something ), Attend some classes. Observe what you have given us.
Get off your Butts and actually see, feel, touch, understand, what you are turning out
Go look. Never mind Dr. Zhang’s Statistics, Grier’s chest beating. Take in the real thing.
You decide then. Is this striving achieving excelling or throwing many of our children away. I bet you don’t have the courage or interest. Just Actually Look That’s what real leaders do.
Have any of you every actually gone and looked.

By the way don’t write it off as well, community college. Check with many of the regional 4 yr colleges and see what they tell you about remediation

Remember. This is after over 30% never made it this far.
Now what all this means I think is that of those that start maybe we are managing to educate less than 30 to 40 % of them.
Stop taking credit for those and worry about the 60 to 70 percent we are throwing away.

Ms Fernandez Ms Josey Why don’t you go look. Write an article. Investigative reporting. Go to GTCC, Alamance Community, Randolph Community.
Beats hell out of all those reports ( I know you mean well ) that are just press releases

This is the answer I got from one board member
Our School Talk Committee just met on Thursday and it will be our recommendation that the Board meet with college/university counselors/registrars to determine how our graduates are fairing in their institutions.
60 to 70 percent of graduates and drop outs can’t function. Reading Writing and Arithmetic and the school talk committee will have the “board meet with college/university counselors/registrars”
Any one! go to GTCC (Developmental Division) and observe. Look at the text books required. Look at the Placement tests.
Just go look

Gee Buckmtn, read the constitution... it protects individual rights even if its at the expense of many (even mobs of Skeet Club crazy racists). You sound like a communist. Communists believe the rights of the majority trump the rights of individuals. You are really confused. Get help before those so called Christians at HPCA find out you are a communist.. they are likely to run you and your children outahere.

The Real Truth

Stormy,

Speechles...you contradict yourself. First you say you are speechless then you give a speech! Funny!

Now let me correct your speech. Education and economics go hand in hand and since government provides education there is no seperating education issues from politics. You make me laugh!

The Real Truth

Real Truth, we only ask that when your dam finally bursts, go and take some of those rich, spoiled, racist scumbags from n. High Point with you, but please, unlike your philosophical partner from last week, don't take any innocents.

Real Truth, that same Constitution is what gives others the right to remove their children from the mis-guided policies of Guilford County.

What speech was that, R.T.? I wrote two sentence. Is that a speech?

I'm glad that I could give you laugh. But, you of all people, calling Buckmtn a communist is the real joke of the day. That's rich, R.T., you do have a sense of humor after all.

Stormy, others:
I apologize if my broadening of the conversation on high school drop-outs is off-putting to some. This is not an op-ed piece. This is asking questions beyond "how much will this program cost?"

Ask your elected officials and government educators why we should work to improve graduation rates (particularly 4-year graduation rates) and one of the reasons they will give is economic, which I'm not saying is bad. They want to keep America economically competitive (and one should ask, why should America strive to be economically competitive?). Hence, Guilford County Schools' goal of making students college/work ready.

Then one should ask, given that as a whole Americans are more "educated" than they have ever been, why are voting statistics notoriously low? Why did the number of jail inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents rise from 193 to 252 from 1995 to 2005 (according to DOJ)? Is that an education issue or a public policy issue?

The country's primary measuring sticks of educational progress here are high school diplomas and college degrees. The public should continue to evaluate the value of both, whether true education is tied to both and what are the obstacles to students obtaining the education they need.

Morgan,

Well said, don't apologize, interesting perspective.. Thanks

The Real Truth

Morgan,

Sorry, but I still really don't fully understand your perspective and the point that you are making. I would guess that you are questioning the wisdom of spending excessive amounts of money to to marginally improve educational levels and work readiness of students. That would be a reasonable argument, I suppose.

Buck,

Would that be 2/10/04 better known as "Black Tuesday" when certain parents laughed as the 8th grade students from SWM were in tears? The night even some board members had tears in their eyes? The night of the Fat Chance Lottery? A day that shall live in infamy?

We applaud you 8th graders of 2004 and 2005. You have made sacrifices. You have paved the way for your peers that followed behind you in 2007. We appreciate all your hard work in this past election, in helping electing a strong school board leader in Garth, a leader who will fight for all children. We hope that you will continue to fight the good fight in the 2008 elections.

We shall never forget.

Morgan,

IMO, Yes a college graduate living paycheck to paycheck to pay off college debt is better off than a high school drop off who lives with family or friends and rides a bus. Sooner or later the college debt will be paid off, but the college education remains always. Sooner or later a high school drop out must learn to make it in the world on his own once his family is gone. One can't get very far without a high school diploma. Of course, the diploma should represent something actually learned.

I do believe that college is not for everyone and that everyone won't make it to college. Those who have no desire to go should not be forced to go. We need plumbers, mechanics, hairdressers, medical technicians, computer techs,
electricians. Every student could learn something he enjoys and that he could do well. For those who are pursuing a trade, we should stress business math, reading, business letter writing, speaking and commmunication skills, computer skills and other skills that would be helpful in learning to run a business. There should not be a stigma attached with these jobs just because some students do now want to go to college. We should encourage various career paths. Many of these jobs pay quite well.

I feel strongly that we need to address the discipline problems in our school so those who want to learn are provided a positive learning environment. For students who constantly disrupt and break the rules there needs to be alternative solutions.

We need to spend our educational dollars on educating those who will make it in society or at least want to try. Everyone child should have an education, but as children get older some will get to the point where you cannot force them to learn if the have no desire.

Do you or anyone else know where one can find the text (as opposed to a summary) of the Graduation Promise Act? It's not up on Thomas and I'm having trouble finding it anywhere.