News-Record.com

All of our schools would make this ranking if we
made all students apply to attend public school and only allowed the students on the campus that
we wanted to allow....

This just indicates the intelligence of the selection pool...not necessarily...the staff and the schools teaching ability. Students at this level can teach themselves and would be successful at any of our schools.

So What?, I agree totally with your comments. From what I understand, most of their students are high performing when they are admitted and actually show little or no GROWTH in performance on their EOC tests. Yes, they can teach themselves, and probably do better on the tests than the teachers would. Also, how are they to be compared to other schools if there are only 100 or so students enrolled. Heck, with those small numbers, they should be doing more! What, about 5 out of their 100 students get free and reduced lunch? Give me a break. Let's concentrate on the majority of students in Guilford County who do not come from priviledged backgrouds and who do not get personal attention and coddling.

You just cant please some people. Some are just not happy unless they are complaining.

I am a Grier critic too but I think that we have to be proud that a school like this exists in GC.

Proud....of What?

Brian....research time?
What is the cost per student of sending a student to this campus versus their home school?
What is the benefit?...
How many students?
How many students are offerred this opportunity?

How would these students fair in the general population? As well as those that are in the top 10 % in the classrooms with 40 or more students in them....or do they need a 1/10 teacher to student ratio to do well.

They do not participate in sports...what about after school activities....What about the drama of a morning/lunch/afternoon fight?

I could name the student but will not... but....
I hardly think that it is fair to the rest of our students to send a bus from Guilford College to Gibsonville, pull up in the driveway, and pick up 1 student. With a handful of students on this bus the ride is shorter than my son has to his community school.

Yet...my son lives 10 minutes from the school and has an overcrowded 1 45 minute bus ride....morning and afternoon
Why?

How do these graduates fair in college?

My son went to one of the five lowest rated
schools in the county....yet his first year in college he had a 4.0 GPA. He currently has a 3.8 GPA at NC State......

So the kids with the great teachers and school with a 1 - 10 ratio should be geniuses and colleges should expect higher test score and grades when reviewing them for entrance!!!

I

AMEN!- "We are only as great as the least of us"

The negativeness that exists in this community about anything good with GCS came from the long years of Terry Griers reign.
Its going to take a long time for forgive and forget.

I know people from where I live will find it hard to forgive. Our school was well and trully screwed by Grier. Only now with the dedicated help of a good principal, good teachers and "some" dedicated parents are we getting our school spirit back!

This is very good for Guilford County. Its well deserved national recognition.Congratulations to all the teachers and GCS Staff who have worked so hard for this.

Cant forget the kids either can we.

We also cant forget the many other kids in GC that are as bright as these kids and do just as well as the kids at E.College.

I get tired of hearing about the "success" of schools in Guilford that should be performing well anyway because they do not have challenging student bodies. The faculty and staff at these schools are always lauded for their "hard work" and dedication when in fact they have to do less work and give little effort to teach the students that walk through their classroom doors. I understand that one teacher there just shows power points to students every day and calls that teaching. It's much easier to teach a child who has been to London three times (so to speak) than one who hasn't been taught to read and right effectively over 14 years of schooling. I think we need to focus our celebratory education stories on the hard working teachers who walk into the difficult situations in traditional schools and dig in hard to help struggling students improve their performance. It's these untold stories that I want to hear about. If that's negative- than so be it.

My, my I cannot believe the bitterness, resentment or envy I hear in some people's comments. I would think you would be proud of the recognition to a school in our county but like a previous poster said, some people are not happy unless they are complaining.

But it is obvious some of the people commenting have no idea about the ECG high school. The students can, and many do, participate in sports. They simply return to their home school, via their own transportation, to attend practices, games, etc. There are plenty of after school activities and clubs to join. Any student can apply to start their own club if they want and the interest is there.

All students are required to do service hours each semester - at least 40 hours. My daughter graduated from the ECG and did her service hours helping every Tuesday at a Title I elementary school tutoring. Many other kids do similar projects in other schools. I like to think they are giving back to our school district through this volunteerism.

I don't think any of her classes had a 10:1 student/teacher ratio, at least not in the 9th and 10th grades. There are usually 50 kids in each grade so I don't see how there could be a 10:1 ratio.

It is selective in who it admits but I still think it is a great school and we should be proud of its recognition.

No envy here. In fact, I am quite satified with my children's school and they do very well. I am a consciencious tax payer. It sounds like a private school to me using public funds. I am happy that you daughter had a good experience, but how about giving to "charity" by sending your child to the traditional school in your district and give that extra money used for school and transportant to someone who needs it more.

Not Impressed:

I don't understand what you mean by giving the extra money used for school and transportation to someone who needs it more. Why would the kids at ECG not deserve any money spent on their transporation and other costs? Do we not spend money on other programs and magnet schools to bus those kids? Why do you feel the money is wasted on the ECG kids and where do you think it could be better spent?

ECG may require an application process but still is open to ANY student in Guilford County, not unlike the IB programs at the various other high schools in our county.

As far as my charity goes, I have personally donated cash and time to my districted school for the past 5 years though I have not had a child in the public school system for the past 2 years. I have always supported the public schools in Guilford County, regardless if my child is currently a student or not.

Forgive me you have 50 kids in each grade level... We only have 400....and we have teachers teaching classes with 44 students in it.I am not bitter...but when we are turned down and told that there is no money to send us another teacher so our classrooms with 40+ students and one teacher can be split....my opinion is a little tainted......

Early college is successful because they only take the top 5 -10 % student from the general schools.... not because of anything that GCS did or anything that the teachers did.....They could have been given a library and a computer and done as well....
Behavior problems.....???
Gangs??
Teachers being cussed out on a daily basis?
what parent would not want this for their child?

I know I would like my kid to be in a school where everyone had to apply to get in. They know what college they want to attend in 8th grade and take the SAT in 8th grade....

What a wonderful world it would be....
I think we should take the top 10% that are college bound out of every school and make one big high school.

What a pride of Guilford county it would be?

I am actually more impressed with the AP Scholars from Andrews, Smith, Dudley, Norhteast, Eastern, Southern......they live in the real world and still succeed....There is no separate and unequal education

NI,

My children have also done very well in a traditional school via AP. My son started NC state as a sophomore because of his AP grades gained at our traditional school. I still find myself very happy for the EC kids and proud of this school in GC.

Try not to bitter and Jealous. With people like you GCS will never win.

This is a E-Mail I sent Mo.

"From your Web page":

"Congratulations to The Early College at Guilford and Weaver Academy for ranking among the nation’s best high schools, according to U.S. News & World Report. The Early College at Guilford ranked 17th on the magazine’s list of America’s top 100 high schools and received gold medal status while Weaver was granted honorable mention"

From US News:
"The first step determined whether each school's students were performing better than statistically expected for the average student in the state. We started by looking at reading and math results for all students on each state's high school test. We then factored in the percentage of economically disadvantaged students (who tend to score lower) enrolled at the school to find which schools were performing better than their statistical expectations"

.Shame shame shame on you,


These schools did well because the students had to be selected/qualified for acceptance into that school.
Of course they will exceed you have gammed the system

You started out with the brightest kids.
They could teach themselves.
Ever Heard Of August Wilson? Look him up. It will be an education.

Early College only has 150 students. ( selected )
Weaver has 229 ( also selected with significantly less on major college track)

The idea of the rankings is to identify schools doing a good job of educating everyone.
Hell,why not simply test into more schools and get more awards.

It is a joke.
You are here. Belly up to the bar and do things right.
Set a standard for all the people on your staff
Your Mom taught you better.

Your system can't stand me but that is because I care about kids
You have inherited a system that most "educators" ( other than fox hole teachers ) are more involved in managing their careers then helping kids

Here is his reply

"Thanks for email. I think we fairly characterized the acknowledgement bestowed by U.S. News and World Report, including its own language. Mo."

Decide for yourselves.

Wow,

All I can say is "Wow"....I have not ventured over to the Chalkboard in a very long time and when I do, I see the same jeolous, ungrateful posters as in the past and I remember why I stopped reading.

Congratulations to the staff, parents and students at The Early College at Guilford. They are an excellent bunch and we should be embracing their achievements.

I'm so sorry for the negative posters here who seemingly cannot for one second, come out of their selfish bubbles and be happy that our system has a nationally recognized school that is being emulated all over the country. It's a school that gives our students yet another choice. I remember the day when most of the comments on the Chalkboard were about having choices in our system!

I'm so sad to read such negative comments from adults who supposedly want a good system. It seems you do not practice what you preach. Shame on you and Kudos to all those that have made The Early College a success.

GCS is bragging on the high performance of their schools....Are they?

How do you measure it?

Would these students be just as successful at their traditional school?

Are we spending this money on a very few students so that "we look good on paper?"

At what cost?

Early college and Weaver have high scores ...because the students that attend are hand selected......I know this because they contacted me wanting my son to attend...why his SAT score from 8th grade.

I am not sure that when you start with students with the highest scores and grades that they are measuring the schools success properly.

Are these students performing at a higher rate than their peers in a traditional schools?

Why don't we expand this option throughout the county and only allow students into our high schools that meet the same requirements as the students at the Early College and Weaver Academy meet.

If we do this we will have the most successful school system in the country and all of students will be offered the same educational opportunities.

SOU,

I totally agree. These people are nothing more that pea brained.

Tax payer and Enlightened.

GC is spening a lot of money at other schools too. My son takes his AP biology class with another 6 kids. These kids are all smart and I am sure they will all pass very well.

Would you cut that opportunity for my son?

I suppose you would prefer everyone of all levels in the same class with no differentiation.

When all students are given the same opportunities to take the same AP courses with AP qualified teachers....then I will jump on the GCS band wagon.....

It is sad when a school with over 1200 students can not even offer one decent AP Chemistry class or AP Biology class.

I am sure that the teachers at these schools work hard and so do the students...but they should have the highest scores.

To whom much is given, much is expected.....

Their scores should be higher on the AP exams given what they start off with. Fours and fives on their AP exams should be the norm.

There is nothing to brag about here.

If it were up to these people there would be no AL classes, Aim, no AP, IB, Lincoln or Weaver.

The Early college is a fast track to college program. its a very tough curriculum that many kids are not good enough to get through. Some get accepted and just drop out after six months because its too tough and others get thrown out because there grades arent good enough.

This is a great program and opportunity for those that are good enough for it.

Well done to all the kids that go to Early college. They are the kids that really deserve this accolade and we should all be very proud of them.

We should be very proud of these kids but let's do something for our many other schools that are failing our kids. I am talking about the schools where discipline is not inforced (most of our high schools and middle schools, drugs are sold in broad daylight with witnesses, gangs recruit new kids and beat up others that won't join, teachers don't have enough supplies, teachers don't have assistants, schools don't have enough nurses, the drop out rate runs rampant and on and on and on.

Kudos to Early College kids but let's remember the majority of the students, families and teachers in Guilford County.

What has Mo done so far other than set up a blog and hire a top PR person that doesn't match the job description GCS's own website post for the job? We paid mo money for Mo. Let's get mo done!

My goodness, you folks are so bitter and twisted.
You will never be happy.

You are turning me into something I'm not.

Early college is a great I repeat great program.
I don't want to see it go away. It is the false rating crap
that bothers me.

"The first step determined whether each school's students were performing better than statistically expected for the average student in the state"

That's a gimme it has been pre ordained.
Everything else is commentary.

It is like NC basket ball playing in the special Olympics

Great scoring but who cares

Enlightenned,

Your hole is getting deper and deeper.

"Kudos to Early College kids but let's remember the majority of the students, families and teachers in Guilford County."

Are you serious? So no accolades for any school until all 117 schools are mentioned in Newsweek?

Selfish, selfish, selfish! You people boggle my mind! I can see why the board of education can't function, NOTHING makes some of you happy! Would you be happier if we had no schools receiving national attention? Would it be better if all the schools were crappy?

So then no schools for low learners? No schools for high learners? No schools for handicapped, just the SAME, SAME, SAME for all?

NUTS, JUST PLAIN NUTS!

Congrats Early College! Ignore the peanut gallery and wallow in your glory!

You miss my point.

I have no beef with Early College.
It is a superb school.

My Beef is with US News and Newsweek that have simply found a scheme to increase circulation by giving out meaningless awards.

Which the people running our system pat themselves on the back with.

Think about it. Newsweek says Smith is in the top 5% of all schools in America.

If that is true we are doomed..

Deeper and deeper!

Enlightened,

Let me enlighten you:

#1: Early College is indeed a great school. One that we should be proud to call our own and work to create more similar programs. So, congratulate them. Didn't your parents teach you any manners? Congratulate them without a "BUT" in your sentence.

#2: If your beef is with Newsweek, go whine to them.

#3: Smith is also doing great things. What's your beef with Smith? The principal there is making great strides, the students are responding and unless you have visited there recently and have a different story, don't publicly bash them.

Our system will continue to border on CRAP if we cannot take the good and run with it. So here's a good article about Early College, let's turn off the negativism and just run with it. There is no reason why we cannot create more schools that give special attention to our special populations. But it won't start by bashing our schools.

Enlightened, does any of this make sense to you or do you just have the need to complain.
I hope you're not going to try to steal Christmas too?

a Scrooge amongst,

Why are you attacking me with such venom?

“Didn't your parents teach you any manners?
“ go whine to them.”
“steal Christmas too?”

I have attacked no individual. None,

“Our system will continue to border on CRAP”
You implied our system borders on crap not me.
I said
“It is the false rating crap”
Also I did not bash a school.
I have simply stated in my way that if Smith is the standard for top 5% in America we are in trouble.
Perhaps doomed is a poor choice of words. I
was simply pointing out the nonsense of the rating system. If we focus on education self esteem will occur.

However if we keep telling ourselves how great we are when we are not we will never improve.

I have simply stated my perceptions and my opinion based on them.

You might consider doing do the same.
Nothing more, nothing less

Enlightened (David Colin)

Oh, by the way. I believe we should create more schools like Early College.
However I also believe if we did much of that the community would be up in arms.
Be careful what you wish for you might get it

Also
From a Scrooge amongst
"#3: Smith is also doing great things. What's your beef with Smith? The principal there is making great strides, the students are responding and unless you have visited there recently and have a different story, don't publicly bash them"

Go on the WEB site and look at their report card.
I did just that.
Not Press releases. The report card.
Hard, real performance data.
If you want to count that as good feel free.
My point is, that if that is good, the country is in trouble..

Have a look

In some ways I agree with DC.
For some schools the Newsweek data is very misleading. Take High Point Central and Grimsley. They are two of our absolute worst schools for dropouts. If you look at their data you can see that Minority kids arent welcome in these schools.

Now, since the Newsweek measurement is the number of Advanced Placement, Intl. Baccalaureate and/or Cambridge tests taken by all students at a school divided by the number of graduating seniors. It therefore stands to reason that if only your best kids are staying at a school and are not dropping out then you will score well. I think that this is an important component that this measurement misses. Also many kids at the IB schools take the AP and the IB exam for a particular subject which inflates the measurement even more.

However, if you look at the 96% pass rate that the Early College has its a tremendous result and opportunity for the kids that go there.

Also, if you take the time to go to Newsweek
then you can see all the comments from the schools all over the country about how proud they are to on the list.

We should be proud too.

Anonymous where did you find the 96% pass
number?

I cannot find any data on the GSC web site.
It was all available there at one time.

Thank You

I am proud of the Early College, but I would like to see this opportunity opened up to more students!!

If this program is successful, we need to increase the number of participants. It serves too small a population for the size of this school district.

However, I agree with the comments that it is not fair to make any comparison of this type of school to any other school in Guilford County.

You are not comparing apples to apples and it should fall within it's own classification.. I do not know what type of schools that this school was compared to...but it should be in a different category.

It is not fair to the schools, teachers or students from other schools.

A school with hand-picked students should be expected to perform exceptionally well on EOC, EOG and AP tests....

I would like to see the individual students growth from middle school to high school...I am sure this is happening and this would show the schools real success.

The AP, IB, Early College, Middle College programs that are successful should be applauded...but we need to do more... a lot more to help our local schools do their jobs....

I am not proud of Guilford county for having a couple of schools with less than 200 students making Newsweek when we have over five high schools with over a 1000 students that are failing the majority of our kids...

When we have 300+ in the freshman class
120+ graduate
180+drop out/jaill/move
40+ go on to college

Is this what we want?
GC...this is nothing to beat your chest about!
So you have helped 1% of the population.
We have a lot of work to do!

Taxpayer

Right on.

You are aware that Early College has only been listed for two years.
in the Newsweek awards. Originally Newsweek did not accept selected schools.
The non accepted selective schools got angry. They wanted an award also. So Newsweek changed the rules you had to have SAT scores less than 1300 (old SAT no writing) to be considered. So Early College with about 1280 made it. If they were a little better they would not have made it

In a sense they have slipped. Originally they were too good to be considered.
In fact 15 of our high schools make the list. We will have arrived when they are too good for the list.

The people with SAT over 1300 know they are good and don’t lack self esteem.

From GCS WEB pages

"Research consistently shows that students who score a three or higher on AP Exams’ one-to-five scale typically experience greater academic success in college and higher graduation rates than students who do not participate in AP"

Now an educator actually wrote this.
Think about what it says and what they are trying to get you to think it says

Did somone actually do research to arrive at this?

For more information, please contact Jane Fleming, executive director for advanced learners, at 370-2316 or Guy Ferguson, AP/IB program coordinator, at 370-8244".

If you score a 5 on an AP exam you will likely score an A at college.
4...B
3...C

Anonymous,

Were did you get that data from? "If you core a 5 on an AP exam you wil likely score an A at college.....

That depends if you are talking about GTCC, A & T, Duke, Harvard or Wake Forest.

An A at one college is not an A at another college. Just like an A from a high school with preselected high-performing students cannot be considered as the same A earned at a regular high school.

If you want a real life comparison....
my child made a 3 on the AP Calculus exam and
a C in the class in our local high school.

He repeated the course at NC State and made an A+ in the course....

My experience says that even if you do not make the grades to get college credit it is well worth the time and effort to be exposed to this level of material. The NC State course was not easy...many students that had no previous exposure failed it.

The same scenario happened with Chemistry and Physics..It made for a perfect 4.0 freshman year...
If he had scored a 4 or 5 he would have started as a sophomore, but I am happy with the 4.0 Freshman year.

My child went to one of the five lowest rated schools in GC and one of the schools which offers the least number of AP Courses.

This program must stay intact and be improved upon...it helps to keep our students competitive in the college market and that is getting harder everyday.

We need more AP qualified teachers in all of our schools and our honors classes need to step up and be honor classes...

I

I

Take pride in Early College…Mr. Colin and others make a good points, skim the cream and point to it as success is at best woefully misleading. It is a great idea for a select few who need that environment, the cost should be evaluated and then you have a nightmare situation. To accomplish this for more kids would destroy the budget. I believe we need the most demanding academics for those kids that will benefit from them, but not all kids want or need or will benefit from that. We actually pay more per student at early college than we do for our most impacted schools. As pointed out it should score as the best private school in Guilford County based upon selection and cost criteria. It should also be viewed and scored as the best private school in GCS. Yes the kids are doing well and kudos are deserved, but place it in context, almost any district could do this.

Now the Twilight School, this is where the real lights should and will shine, Smith is working hard but has a long road to drive and along with Dudley there is some great hope and opportunities. We do have a long way to go with Andrews still. Central and Grimsley are both very minority friendly, but analysis of the data must go much deeper to see this.

On the positive side, teachers and principals are telling me there is a new, fresh air atmosphere in the district, maybe this will help and filter down to our kids, maybe we can make our schools safe and inviting again. An aircraft carrier does not turn on a dime, in fact it takes a lot of planning and coordination to helm a great boat, GCS is such a boat as is society. We have a novice skipper and a crew that is set in old ways, it will take awhile. Patience, persistence and high expectations as well as love and service must find balance.

Garth,

I am very impressed with what Guilford county Schools offers our students and how well the budget is handled. It is very difficult considering the size, scope, and broad range of needs of our students. I don't think anyone here wants to see the Early College program to go away, because it is a great concept program for some students.

However, based on the Newsweek rating system..I am not impressed with the ranking.
it is good ... but "it is expected". It is not an adequate measurement of the school and staff's
teaching ability.

Anyone can teach a smart kid....but can they challenge one...to go beyond the norm.

I would expect these students to do better....
the question is "are the students being challenged to their mental potential"....

What are they accomplishing beyond what they would be exposed to in a regular high school setting?

I don't know how you would measure that...

Unbelievable:

"So then no schools for low learners? No schools for high learners? No schools for handicapped, just the SAME, SAME, SAME for all?

NUTS, JUST PLAIN NUTS!

Congrats Early College! Ignore the peanut gallery and wallow in your glory!"

Sorry, but why shouldn't all schools be equal? I thought that was the general idea, that all schools were treated equally and presented every student an equal opportunity for education. Do we really want to have a Low Learners School? Can you imagine how devastated a student would be to be assigned to that school? How would you feel if your child was assigned to that school? Doesn't GCS have a legal responsibility to treat all schools equally?

And, wallow in your glory? What a strange statement. Wallow means to roll the body about indolently or clumsily. So, excellent students should do that? Strange.

We all have to remember that not every school is a good fit for every student, nor is every student a good fit for every school. So, in Guilford County we have many different types of high schools to open as many different opportunities as we can for all students. Abilites, capabilities and motivations will differ widely among our students, and enough opportunities should be available so that every student is pushed to their fullest. Equality of opportunity is not the same as educational equity, and while we should strive to make the opportunities equal we must constantly be reminded that achievement will be individual--to a school or a student.

Even if the Newsweek kudos are based on faulty logic or skewed statistics, I accept them for what they are and am still proud that GCS has a place like Early College, all the various middle colleges, the Twilight School, the academies, etc. It shows that we are trying to meet the varying needs of our students . . . all young people are educationally needy, only their needs are different.

Enlightened quoted from Newsweek that Smith is in the top 5% of schools in America.

A Scrooge Amonst Us said, "What's your problem with Smith?"

Last Thursday's Rhino quotes Noah Rogers, the principal at Smith, "60 percent of the male students at Smith are reading below grade level."

Now if 60% of Smith's male students are reading below grade level, and Newsweek says Smith is in the top 5% of schools in America, I wonder how the other 95% of our schools in America are doing?

What is wrong with this picture people?

Jack, that is a wonderful summary.

To the anonymous who said "NUTS, PLAIN NUTS and imagine how devastated a student would feel go to a low performers school.

Well how would that student feel when he continues to be lost and flounder endlessly in a sea of students who can keep up? How will he feel when he is 16 years old and still in middle school? How will he feel when he drops out and can't find a job?

There is nothing wrong with a school for slow learners. It is all in the presentation. This school should be welcome as a learning opportunity for one to learn on their level, for educators to meet the students' needs, build them up and reach students who might learn a little differently.

Also how do you thing the other 20+ students feel in a regular classroom environment when a few frustrated, slow learners continually disrupt class because they don't "get it" OR the fast learners disrupt because they are totally bored?

I think it's great that GCS is trying to meet the needs of all their students. They have a long way to go but at least programs are in place. Now they need to collect data on what programs are actually working and eliminate the programs that are failing and wasting our tax dollars.

OMG:

I always wonder how much of the anger lingers from Grier's tenure . . . I always thought his agenda had as much to do with padding his resume as anything else. But now we have, as you said, programs in place that are having a beneficial affect on students and that could do even more; even if Grier proposed them for all the wrong reasons doesn't mean these programs can't be a good thing for GCS.

I also wonder at the anger which seems directed at students who, through no fault or deserving of their own, have been blessed with greater abilities, both natural and acquired, when they are given anything that seems "extra". Yes, they can "teach themselves" if all anyone expects from them is performance on state-wide, minimal standards tests; however, if you expect them to achieve to their fullest, they need good teachers who are trained to push them. Just as struggling students need good teachers who are trained to push them. I think if anyone talked to students in the VSN program at Lincoln or at Early College, they would discover that they are not being coddled but rather whipped. My own son, when he was at Lincoln, came home bushed at the end of each day . . . and that was as it should be. As it should be for every student at every school in GCS.

Thats exactly what its ike at the Early college.
I think they take 5 AP's in their sophomore year
(not sure how many in Freshmen year).

I really doubt that any private school ( at least in GC) teaches to anywhere near that level (Garth take note). Private schools have o also cater for different levels. Its not a fact that all private schools kids are exceptional. At the Early Colleg it just about is!

Yes, there is much anger still directed at this school system because of Grier.

Years of lying, false statistics, bussing, failed programs (one after another) and not listening to the public.

Its hard to accept that there are some good things around.

I think we have to forget him. We need to pull together because Public Education in our society is a tough cause and it will not get any better if we throw stones at the good things we have going for it!

Anon,
I would like to know what the standard curriculum at the Early College is. How many students take
AP classes and in what year? How well are they doing in these classes?

We have juniors at our school taking 4 and 5 AP classes...and as sophomores maybe 2 at a time.

Freshman year 1 or 2.
Five at a time is most definately a lot....

From Newsweek
"NEWSWEEK's Challenge Index is designed to recognize schools that challenge average students, and not magnet or charter schools that draw only the best students in their areas. These top performers, listed below in alphabetical order, were excluded from the list of top high schools because, despite their exceptional quality, their sky-high SAT and ACT scores indicate they have few or no average
students"

From Early College WEB pages

"SAT Results: The present mean SAT score for the Class of 2008 is 1958 (1312 critical reading and mathematics). The mean SAT score for the Class of 2007 was 1959 (1310 critical reading and mathematics); SAT results ranked the School second (2007, 2005, 2003) and third (2004, 2006) in North Carolina for the last five years. NOTE: highest score in each area used to calculate mean scores"

In order to get into the rankings they must have lied to Newsweek

This is the ethics of the people teaching our
children

Cheating works.

Builds Character.

Mo, Garth

Look into this if you care.

Mr. Colin,

Newsweek does their own investigating. They look at public data, they don't call the schools. Therefore, I highly doubt the folks down at Early College "lied" about anything.

From the Newsweek article, "We analyzed 21,069 public high schools in 48 states using data from the 2006-2007 school year. This is the total number of public high schools in each state that had grade-12 enrollment and sufficient data to analyze primarily for the 2006-2007 school year."

Enlightened,

Your quote above is from Newsweek Magazine. (Were Early college was ranked #21)

The article this thread refers to is the ranking by U.S. News and World Reports.

My, how quick you are to condemn our schools. Calling administrators “liars” is pretty venomous, don’t you think? Better call off Garth and Mo, your bad.

Check with the school system.

I believe they send the data to the magazines.
I know they do for Newsweek.
I could be wrong.

I can't imagine the magazines getting it any other way
However you may be correct check

Perhaps lied is a bad word.
I apologize
How about misinformed

My facts are straight.
I understand the thread.

"The 2009 U.S.News & World Report America's Best High Schools methodology, developed by School Evaluation Services, a K-12 education data research business run by Standard & Poor's, is based on the key principles that a great high school must serve all its students well, not just those who are bound for college and that it must be able to produce measurable academic outcomes to show that the school is successfully educating its student body across a range of performance indicators"

"great high school must serve all its students well, not just those who are bound for college"

What do you think?
I think It is simply a college prep school.

Fine by me.

Those are the facts.
Think what you please.

I still think it is a great school.
But it starts out with the cream of the crop.

The whiners who complain about the Early College are the same whiners who dont want their kids bussed to equal out the schools and give all kids an opportunity.

GC will never win with this lot!

Yeah, They dont want the kids at the low end of the scale to improve and then they want to scrooge it for the high acheivers too.
Selfish, selfish, selfish people.

Actually I don't think the schools or the kids
are the problem.

The schools are fighting a loosing battle for the kids at at the low end.

It's the home life or lack of it that creats the
problem.

Nobody knows how to cope with that issue.
So we create smoke screens ( Mission this, award
that advanced technology you name it.)

If I still had kids in school I'd opt for Early college if my kids could make it.in.

The educators game the numbers for survival.

Remember the lady running against Mo.
The accusations were that she had kids( sure
failure risks ) removed from classes that were scheduled for EOC testing.

Take math it's ruthlessly cumulative. If you have been continuously passed on, It will catch up with you. AYP will be small if at all.

Now actually we can very early on identify the kids that will struggle, drop out etc.. One need only look
at the early grade school attendance figures.
Every one in education knows that. They just don't know what to do. By the way either do I

Don't show up, Don't Learn. Pass them on. Pull the whole system down Ultimate failure.and mediocrity

That is the cycle.

Early College to the rescue for the chosen few good enough.

David,

EC is good but there are still plenty of opportunities at other schools. Dont doubt that.

My daughter enrolled at NC State this year as a sophomore because of the AP credit she got from her years at Ragsdale.

Its not EC but I am very satisfied with the education she got there and the AP classes she could take thanks to Guilford County Schools.

Dave, I think you are out of touch in that regard.

I have a close friend in Winston who took very few AP classes there. I have another at Wesleyan. Same there.

GC is the best kept secret around in my book.

"I think you are out of touch in that regard"

out of touch in what regard?

I have no doubt that you have a very bright
daughter.

I think AP courses are great for people up to the challange.

I think they should be offered.

Where the pass rate ( 3 on AP courses) is low ( much less than 50%) something is wrong.

Kids from solid homes ( economically and caring )
don't have problems.

Your kid is fine Ragesdale Report card says lots of them are not,

Arround 30 to 40 percent don't make the grade.

Just have a look.

I lot to look at this with more of an open mind. They are college level classes so some kids will not make it but I still think that kids will still gain from it even if they end up getting a non pass rate of 2 for instance.

For one thing the AP curriculum is the College boards and not GCS.

I mean at least its not watered down which is something that a lot of people have complained about over the years on this blog.

Now here is what US news did

"We analyzed 21,069 public high schools in 48 states using data from the 2006-2007 school year. This is the total number of public high schools in each state that had grade-12 enrollment and sufficient data to analyze primarily for the 2006-2007 school year. A three-step process determined the best high schools. The first two steps ensured that the schools serve all their students well, using state proficiency standards as the measuring benchmarks. For those schools that made it past the first two steps, a third step assessed the degree to which schools prepare students for college-level work.

The first step determined whether each school's students were performing better than statistically expected for the average student in the state. We started by looking at reading and math results for all students on each state's high school test. We then factored in the percentage of economically disadvantaged students (who tend to score lower) enrolled at the school to find which schools were performing better than their statistical expectations.
For those schools that made it past this first step, the second step determined whether the school's least-advantaged students (black, Hispanic, and low income) were performing better than average for similar students in the state. We compared each school's math and reading proficiency rates for disadvantaged students with the statewide results for these disadvantaged student groups and then selected schools that were performing better than this state average.

Schools that made it through the first two steps became eligible to be judged nationally on the final step, college-readiness performance, using Advanced Placement and/or International Baccalaureate test data as the benchmarks for success. (AP is a College Board program that offers college-level courses at high schools across the country.) This third step measured which schools produced the best college-level achievement for the highest percentages of their students."

Now
The School has 7,. I repeat 7, disadvantaged
select students

Now

"We compared each school's math and reading proficiency rates for disadvantaged students with the statewide results for these disadvantaged student groups and then selected schools that were performing better than this state average"

I think even the good DR. Zang would laugh.
The statistical sample is absurd.

Mo, did you or your staff actually look at this.

Everyone is gamming the numbers and doesn't have a clue. Including US News. However they just want to sell magazines we have to educate all kids

We have an elitist school with 7 disadvantaged kids and were proud of our accomplishment.

Given the free lunch program we must have what 40% disadvantage and only 7 are bright enough to be in this school.

Ask Zang what he thinks would come out of a normal distribution. Where are those kids?.

Shane on us.

Amos Quick I would question this. Very hard

But if your kids at Early College you got yours

"But if your kids at Early College you got yours"

General statement not meant to be directed at Mr Quick

Being smart is elitist?

Of course not.
I never said that

But eliminating the smart disadvantaged kids is.

Their maybe 40% of our system and 4% of Early College at Guilford.

Enlightened,

Go on-line and look at the application to the Early college at Guilford. No where on it does it ask for income. Is that what you mean by "disadvantaged"? I don't get what you're upset about. ALL kids in Guilford county can apply to attend. The application period is announced each year. (I think it starts Feb. 1st.) It's not some big secret as you would like people to think. If a student is interested, they should apply. It's open to ALL students. You would like us to believe they are screening applicants based on income and that's not true. If you would like, maybe you could go round up some new recruits this year to apply to appease whatever agenda it is you are pursuing. I don't get it.

"Did you child not get in? is that your beef? said"
I don't have a beef with the school.
Why don't you believe me?
I don't have any school age children

You can screen without formally screening.

However the school knows how many disadvantaged they have.

So does Newswweek and US news..

How difficult is it to get transpottation there?

I'm only saying that statistically there must be more disadvantaged that qualify.

Why don't they go?.

David,

I have always enjoyed your posts but I think you are taking this one a little far.

What do you think other school systems are doing to get this recognition?

Maybe GCS have for once played the system and have done something right?

Everybody else is doing it.

Good point about the other schools.

Actually with news week thats not true,

The other selective schools with high SATs did not misinform and none were on the list.

The schools do send info directly to Newsweek.
The selective schools make a selective list.

I can only conclude that we lied.

I really can't comment on US News other than to say
that their process of comparing 7 selective high intelligence low income students results against the
state average for low income students performance
is absurd.

As far as Everyone is doing it.
Everyone got into subprime mortgage bonds.

You don't teach your kids Cheating Pays..

Reading these comments makes me feel really sad. There is so much resentment against gifted and talented students. False assumptions abound. One of them is that if a child is in the top ten percent of his class, he must be from a twpparent home and live in at least a middle class neighborhood. While many children who do well in school do come from stable families who live in middle class or economically more advantaged areas, a number of other equally bright students do not. This is true now just as it was forty to sixty years ago when huge numbers of Americans were educated in very small schools, sometimes referred to as the one-room school house. I am curious about who came up with the number of disadvantaged students at Early College was only seven. That defies logic.

Another repeating theme in some of the blogs is that teachers of bright children do not have to do anything because the children can just "teach themselves". Teach themselves what? Who chooses what these student's learn and where they go to find their information? Teaching gifted and talented students is enormously challenging because they want to know not just what. They want to know why. They do not demand that their teachers know everything, but they expect them to be worthy guides.

Many of the students who elect to attend Early College at Guildford are children whose thirst is for knowledge. True, many of them participate in sports and other activities; some of them are school sponsored. Other students may pursue some other individual passion. If there were no Early College at Guilford, some of these students would be back in high schools where the intensity of their desire to learn would be seen as odd, and they would be getting pushed around the hallways moving from class to class while trying to work out a physics problem.

Twenty to forty percent of high school drop-outs are not the students at the bottom of end of the statistical pile of gobblety-gook. There are plenty of bright people out there for whom being gifted was far more of a burden than a blessing.

Reading these comments makes me feel really sad. There is so much resentment against gifted and talented students. False assumptions abound. One of them is that if a child is in the top ten percent of his class, he must be from a twpparent home and live in at least a middle class neighborhood. While many children who do well in school do come from stable families who live in middle class or economically more advantaged areas, a number of other equally bright students do not. This is true now just as it was forty to sixty years ago when huge numbers of Americans were educated in very small schools, sometimes referred to as the one-room school house. I am curious about who came up with the number of disadvantaged students at Early College was only seven. That defies logic.

Another repeating theme in some of the blogs is that teachers of bright children do not have to do anything because the children can just "teach themselves". Teach themselves what? Who chooses what these student's learn and where they go to find their information? Teaching gifted and talented students is enormously challenging because they want to know not just what. They want to know why. They do not demand that their teachers know everything, but they expect them to be worthy guides.

Many of the students who elect to attend Early College at Guildford are children whose thirst is for knowledge. True, many of them participate in sports and other activities; some of them are school sponsored. Other students may pursue some other individual passion. If there were no Early College at Guilford, some of these students would be back in high schools where the intensity of their desire to learn would be seen as odd, and they would be getting pushed around the hallways moving from class to class while trying to work out a physics problem.

Twenty to forty percent of high school drop-outs are not the students at the bottom of end of the statistical pile of gobblety-gook. There are plenty of bright people out there for whom being gifted was far more of a burden than a blessing.