News-Record.com

I hope so. As a ex regular at the GGO, I prefer Sedgefield. I still think they will have trouble with their date.

The central location should draw a larger crowd and more prominent sponsors and players. The prestige of the Donald Ross course and the history behind the club should certainly lend a hand in getting larger name golfers to commit to the tournament.

This would be a great move for the tournament, large FOCC buy-out fee not withstanding. Better venue for sure - course, amenities, and location. It’s certainly a plus when you look at sponsor interest and fan attendance. Unfortunately, the Wyndham's biggest problem is their date, and that is completely in the hands of the Tour.

Let's hope this thing gets finalized soon so the community can really get behind it.

It's a great move to get out of Forest Oaks. The area has gone downhill and it's not a great place for the tournament. Sedgefield will be in closer proximity to other parts of the Triad who are more golf friendly.

I'm still thinking that the tournament will eventually move to Grandover, with the resort becoming a Wyndham property.

The poor tourney management by the foundation will not be cured by a move alone. The date is the issue. The news and record has also hurt the event by always pointing out what the event is not. Instead of embracing what it is. FOCC has hosted the event since 1977. If the event does move FOCC deserved better than the bashing it received from the N&R. Now the paper and the foundation will have only themselves to blame if the event falters. I am sure the event will get better spin now that the two have their way.

As a long time resident of "downhill" Forest Oaks, I say Good Riddance!

Speaking of "downhill," another possible benefit could be the revitalization of High Point Road.

I feel this is a huge risk for Sedgefield CC. The tournament is only under contract with Wyndam thru 2010. The move from Sedgefield to FO was not because the members but because Sedgefield was no longer a challenge to the longer hitting pros. The renovation will help, but to make Sedgefield a challenge, they will have to trick up the course with the pin positions. That will frustrate the pros and hurt future fields. To make this tournament a success, it needs to be at Grandover, put the pros up in the hotel, and offer southern hospitality. A date change to the Spring would also help

At Sedgefield the tournament should attract more name golfers than was the case at Forest Oaks. Let's hope the August weather returns to more normal seasonal highs than the past two years. Rough will be at its best in August, and the greens should be in excellent shape and capable of making putting a challenge.

The course can hold large galleries; just look at the lithograph of hole eighteen in the 1970 tournament, won by Gary Player. A lot of people came every year to see the tournament in March; with a quality field I'll bet the same will be true in August.

The move to Sedgefield is a dumb move. While Forest Oaks doesn't have the nicest clubhouse and facilities, the last time I checked it was about the golf course. Sedgefield is not a challenging course and the pros will eat it alive unless they put in some really tricky pins and roll the greens to where they are like glass. I think Sedgefield has a nice course, but it's not a PGA Tour course in my opinion. The next option in Grandover is a laugh because it's a resort style course, not a PGA players course, so you people need to get off that option.

Forest Oaks is a nice course, but the money in Greensboro want it moved and now they have their wish. Now it's on them to see what they can with it and now they won't have the Forest Oaks excuse and the bashing can end. The tourney won't survive at any course until the date is changed. You just can't expect to get the big names when you follow a major, I don't care where you play it. People in Greensboro seem to think the tournament is going to prosper because of a move to a more central location, let's get real.

What's funny to me is that Sedgefield was tired of this tournament in the 70's and it moved to Forest Oaks because of various reasons. Now, they want it back. You can have it, GOOD LUCK!!!!!

I echo Lane, Melvin Hopper, and Mike D.'s comments. The move won't magically bring the tourney back to life. Besides, the whole article was premature, nothing is even finalized yet. Remember......

Tournament director Mark Brazil issued a statement Wednesday denying the Wyndham was returning to Sedgefield for the Aug. 14-17 event.

"A lot of rumors have been flying around for quite some time," Brazil said. "No deals are in place; we are still working on this. Several options are still available, including a return to Forest Oaks."

Newmaniac-did you read the article? Are you living in fantasyland? The tournament is gone, why would they release all this if it wasnt leaving. Back to reality bro!

No matter where it's played it will still be a silly game -
Years ago, at an Atlanta pro-am, Hank Aaron said it best when he noted that pro golfers demand absolute peace and quiet when bending over a perfectly still golf ball while attempting to tap it into a perfectly still hole less than 15 yards away or tee up a perfectly still golf ball so that they might drive it down a 200 foot wide fairway -
He noted that while Don Drysdale or Sandy Kolfax was throwing a 95 MPH fastball inches from his head 50,000 nearby people were screaming, stomping their feet, and sloshing beer not one sole held up a "quiet" sign.
No matter where it's played it will still be a silly game and Tiger still won't show -

The whole issue started with a Mark Brazil led to have Davis Love redesign Forest Oaks, instead of looking at many other options. It appears that the Love design and name has not produced as Mark promised, heck Davis has only shown up periodically on the course his company built- pretty sorry.

Sedgefield would be a good host and a change to recreate some excitement.

I think all this churn will not be solved by moving the tourney to a different clubhouse a few miles away. The Tour, corporations, and many of the Pros have made the game far less enjoyable over the years. The ropes move further back each year and corporate tents block most greens keeping fans away from the action. The Pros also have developed an attitude that it is all about the Nike Emblem and individual fans are not important. It's all about the corporate sponsors.

Do you think Arnold Palmer or Fuzzy would have taken the attitude of Davis Love if FO had just given him millions to redesign the course? "Oh I don't care about FO...I already have my money out of the deal". The Pros will always find a reason to complain. Brazil will endorse any change or say anything to keep his job. It doesn't help that Ed Hardin needs to be an obituary writer instead of a sports writer. Bumkin County Commissioner Yow thinks golf is played with bumpers and every hole is par 2. Greensboro has proven over and over that it is only interested in driving over 50 miles to see professional sports. Greensboro is not interested enough in golf to keep a Tour stop here and it is not all about apathy. The sport itself needs a facelift. Good luck Sedgefield because you have your work cut out for you.

I think we are extemely lucky to have a PGA Tour event in our town, wherever it's played. I think the News and Record should remember that, as should people who like to complain about the event in any way, shape, or form.

How many other cities can claim that they host a Tour event? NO other city could claim that they host a tournament played on a Donald Ross course (right now). I agree with Mike D. about Grandover...what are we gonna do, give the players a ride in a cart on some of those 1/2 mile treks between green and next tee?

As for the point about Sedgefield not wanting the tourny in the 70s, golf in the 70's is much different than golf in the 00s. It's a whole different game, and not just on the course.

Thanks to Mark Brazil, Bobby, and the rest of the stewards of this tournament for continuing to try and make this a successful tournament that we can keep in the area for years to come.

Sedgefield is definately a more prestigous location and the tudor clubhouse would make the perfect back drop. Sedgefield is also much closer to Greensboro and the other Triad cities. logistically speaking, I alway though Forest Oaks didnt make sense. I think the move may help draw some bigger player but dont expect Tiger Woods. I agree with what others have said about the dates. It seems like everytime the tournament is moved to a new date, its always in between larger tournaments so the biggest player like Tiger Woods skip Greensboro to get rest.

at one time Grandover was considered as an option. There were even whispers of turning the Grandover Resort into the Wyndam Resort so the hotel chain's resort hotel could serve as a back drop for the tournament and could provide a place for spectators to stay during the tournament. But it looks like they are going with Sedgefield.

Moving the tournament to Sedgefield or whatever will not attract the big names. The date sucks!

I think all this "hearsay" is from Mark Brazil trying to start something up. Even the PGA Tour has no knowledge of an agreement between Sedgefield and the foundation.

FOREST OAKS SUCKS ! too much hype...dumpy houses...no wonder Tiger and other prominent golf pros NEVER come here...the move to SEDGEFIELD will prove optimum results...finally a real tournament in a real community....

I just deleted a comment because the commenter made a personal attack on another commenter. Not allowed. Discuss the course, not each other.

Too bad some of the commenters have their noses too high in the air to see the real world and must resort to snide comments about our community and golf course.

I wonder...as a Business Developer in the area why people continue to trash the Forest Oaks Community. Perhaps you have not been out to visit us recently...I mean, take a good look around....The course looks good and will be great at tournament time, property values at here continue to rise, developers such as myself are applying for permits right and left for the opportunity to serve this great community...developement is going on North, South, East and West of the Forest Oaks Golf Course Community...You think all of us would want to spend money on something that was not a solid investment? You want the tournament...take it. Our thriving community will remember when things fall apart, as they did before....and will have to really think long and hard before we would ever rescue the tournamnet again. Until then, we have a wonderful place to golf, swim, and get together with friends and talk about how everyone is starting to develop out here...I think we win no matter what!

Just curious;where will people park at Sedgefield?

Forest Oaks is not a harder course than Sedgefield, especially after their redesign. With rough and quick greens, Sedgefield will be a much more difficult test than Forest Oaks, which mostly relied on length and little else. As someone who has played both Sedgefield and Forest Oaks numerous times, Sedgefield is a better test of golf and also a much better layout. I personally never thought Forest Oaks was a great course, and thought it paled in comparison to Sedgefield and also Starmount, but Davis Love's redesign really ruined whatever character it did have. It's an non-descript, completely unmemorable golf course now, and it's not hard to see why Tour players have little interest in coming to play it.

However, other posters have been right when they said the date is what's holding back the tournament more than anything. When the tournament is held right after the PGA Championship and right before the "playoffs", no top names are going to show up. Sedgefield has the ability to draw better names than Forest Oaks did, but not at its current spot in the calendar.

EG, play Sedgefield Saturday and then Forest Oaks Sunday. I gurantee your score will be higher at FO. Tell me then which is a better test of golf. :-)

Back to the original question....the fact of the matter is, as stated so many times before, the move to Sedgefield is not going to bring the tourney back to life and bring the PGA's top pros. The contract is through 2010 and after that the PGA will probably wipe the tournament off the map completely. It can't exist on the revenue it's generated in the past few years and I really don't think we're going to see it increase substantially, albeit at Sedgefield or wherever.

One thing I have learned through this whole ordeal and by reading the responses here by those whom I presume to be Sedgefield members is that there sure are some pompous people around. As a working class individual, I feel very fortunate to have the opportunity to be a Forest Oaks member where other members accept me with open arms and, frankly, am glad to not be a "lower status" member at one of the "more prestigious" clubs.

The residents of forest oaks lost at least $100,000 re-sale value on their old school houses. I just made $100,000 on my re-sale value towards my 2004 three story stucco house here in Sedgefield...thanks to the Wyndham! Hey triad? now we dont have to drive all the way out in the country (woods)

Exactly the attitude I was speaking of. The personal attacks are childish. Some of us are actually quite proud of our "old school" houses. I hope it makes you feel good to demean others.

There is a reason the GGO is moving from Forest Oaks. Forest Oaks hasnt put any money into their facilities in years. As a volunteer who has spent a lot of my vacation time helping to run the tournament I must say the the Forest Oaks facilities are in terrible condition. The headquarters building that is the tennis shop is run down, old nasty carpet, and smells terrible consistently. This is the same year after year. The players locker rooms are small and cramped, again old nasty smelling carpet and tight compact quarters. These are just a few of the highlights that Sedgefield is a better location.
Secondly, when I caddied on Pro Am day 2 years ago, numerous times the Pros said that "this must be an old neighborhood" due to the bad condition of the houses lining the holes. I know the houses are older models and designs but the pros notice these things. Sedgefield has a diffrent feel, and a feel that you can promote among the tour players.

If you live in any community because a golf tourney is played there for 4 days a year you are insane. It is nice to have and a fun couple of days but if that is all you are about then you need to get a life. If you think your house is valued + or - $100K based on this then you are equally out of touch. Wait maybe that is a good idea if it does leave then the FO residents can send their tax bills to the fine folks a few miles away.

Newmaniac: Forest Oaks has length and not much else after Davis Love's abortion of a re-design. He ruined the golf course. I liked Forest Oaks before the re-design; not as much as Sedgefield or Starmount, but it was a good golf course. Now it has very little going for it, at least in my opinion. I'd rather just go play Bryan Park semi-regularly than join out at Forest Oaks (and no, I'm not a member at ANY country club).

But I disagree regardless. The greens at Sedgefield following the redesign are more difficult than the ones at Forest Oaks -- and with tournament conditions of narrowed fairways and rough, as well as tight lies around the greens and quick green speeds, I think professional players will have a harder time shooting low scores at Sedgefield than they did at Forest Oaks (although they should still go under par with ease). But I guess we'll see in a few months.

EL, you have just proven that you have no clue what you're talking about. To say that the greens at Sedgefield are tougher than FO.......get real.

I'm actually becoming quite amused by this. I hope the tourney does go to Sedgefield so the pros can shoot the lights out and we can stand back and say, "told you so." :-)

Something I forgot to add for you Sedgefield folks.......

Think back to the Howard Coble Tournament that was held at Sedgefield shortly after the redesign was completed. Remember who won? It wasn't a group of members from Sedgefield, it was a group from Forest Oaks.......and not even the Oaks' finest at that. Care to guess why they shot the lowest score? Because they are accustomed to playing a tougher course.

I'm not knocking Sedgefield by any means. It's a great course with a spectacular clubhouse and beautiful, elegant houses surrounding it. I'm just saying that Forest Oaks doesn't deserve the bashing it's getting.

This is a trip! I am a scratch golfer, yes a backwoods Forest Oaks hillbilly with an old broken down house that is on the fairway of this miserable course. You know Davis Love didn't do the best job redesigning this course. Most members of FO will tell you that, but I would have to say that Sdgefield is a much easier course and I agree with Newmaniac.

I like Sedgefield, Cardinal and other clubs in the area, but Forest Oaks is the ideal spot for the tourney based on the course, I said course not facilities. I will admit that we have an organization that doesn't sink any money into the club and that's sad. We most likely will lose the tourney to you rich boys or wanna be rich boys some of you and that's fine because you will fail. There's no doubt that if the date stays the same you will fail and the tourney will move to somewhere like metro Raleigh where they can support a tournament and do something with it. Sedgefield certainly isn't going to change things and make any difference with the pros. Some may come out of curiousity, but you're not going to pull any of the big boys here. Bottom line, you're not all that and most of you on here make it sound like you're some big TPC course or something that draws rave reviews. Please get off it!

I like my club and for all you Sedgefield people who try and put us down, do us a favor and stay on your side of town and leave us be. We'll keep playing out goat track as some make it out to be. And by the way, I keep hearing talk about Sedgefield's greens, get real no comparison to the Oaks. Peace!

The reality is that Greensboro will never be a top tier event again. Big money (not purse, big money influence aka Charlotte) and big cities have passed us by. However, WE HAVE A PGA TOURNAMENT. How many cities in the US can say that? Not very many and most don't have to add state next to their name when you describe them. The move to Sedgefield will do two things.. attact more fans to the tournament for the next two years because of the central location (and memories of GGO in it's heyday) and that will in turn make more money for the charities of the triad. Not a bad end result in my opinion. If you want big names then you have to align with sponsors and or charities of the big sponsors to draw the big names at regular pga tour events.. (dates help too but those usually get worked out as part of macro economic deals) think tiger plays in almost every buick tournament and the deutsche bank in Canton, MA because he likes the bank and driving buicks? If you want stars then you have to have a plan and Brazil is on track with the AJGA sponsorships and recruiting former local college talent. Just like all things in the south it is all about relationships and both of these initiatives are great ways to recruit fresh top talent. (sedgefield will give them a better first class experience and interest in coming back)

Although we've got to set expectations appropriately... if we get 3 of the top 10 we've hit the mega load. Go for the experience and go to support charities in the Triad. Don't go expecting to see Hogan, Palmer or Snead walk through the Sedgefield Clubhouse door... those days are over.

Want top players?

Hire a tournament director from a major tournament or charlotte's operations guy who is doing the real work but not getting the credit.

OK not possible?

Hire a tournament director from a defunct but popular tournament like the 84 Lumber or the soon to be PODS Championship. Brazil is minor league. Need to bring in a real PRO tournament director.

Good move on course and improved sponsor but need a guy who holds some clout to bring in the big dogs.

The date will be a problem, who wants to watch golf in the hottest part of summer.
Last years temps in August were almost 100 degrees not to mention the high humidity.

So it looks like they will be announcing the move tomorrow. Sedgefield can have it. The contract is through 2009 (two whole years...wow *insert sarcasm*) with the possibility to extend it on an annual basis. This tournament, as I've said before, will fall off the map in a couple of years.

I couldn't agree more with "good idea" though. The tournament started it's downward spiral in 2001, care to guess who was also hired on to direct it that year? Take a look at the timeline here.....
http://wyndhamchampionship.com/history.asp

Mark Brazil is one of the main reasons we have a tournament now and that we will for years to come.
There are many so called "top-tier" tournaments that would love to have someone of his caliber as their Tournament Director.
This area is very fortunate that we have an event like The Wyndham Championship and a group behind it like the Foundation Board and Mark Brazil and his staff.

Mark Brazil hasn't done much for the tourney since he came on board. It seems to me Mark Brazil is more lip service than action and we will get more of that later today. This tourney will not survive with the current date and that's ashame give its history in the area.

I personally don't see the real improvement on the course issue and location given that Forest Oaks is only 10-15 minutes from downtown and is right off the new urban loop now. This whole thing comes down to money and the group that heads this gig wanted it at Sedgefield in their backyard with the nice homes lining the fairway and the plsuh clubhouse. Sedgefield will put on a decent tourney I'm sure, but it will be cramped because they have no space and this just doesn't seem to be a PGA Tourney course compared to other courses they play each week. The greens are nice, but it will need alot of work to get PGA ready.

Mr. Hattori the owner at Forest Oaks should feel ashamed for lying to its members. The tourney is going nowhere, my intentions are to keep the tourney at Forest Oaks he says. What a joke!!!!

I just love to read comments of those who have no idea what they are talking about. The golf tournament started it's down hill slide in the late 90's, due to poor leadership of both Greensboro Jaycee presidents, and the General Chairmen that they chose. The PGA hand picked Mark to run this event, and bring it to another level, and he has! Only the fools, blind, and the jealous are speaking out against him. Think you can do better, or improve it, bring yourself down to tournament HQ's, and sign up to volunteer.

I find it humorous that folks are always looking to lay blame. As several have said prior, we in this community are lucky to have a tournament of this caliber, period. This is the PGA Tour, folks. We now know it's a done deal. The tournament is moving. Let's get behind it.

I'm not a member of either FOCC or Sedgefield. Can't afford it. But I am a long time volunteer at the event. There are lots of things I like about FOCC. I have friends who live there. Shoot, I wish I could join them. But if you say the event was heading in the right direction, you've got your head in the sand. This isn't FO's fault. And it ain't Mark Brazil's fault either. I don't know anyone who could take an event sandwiched between the final major of the year and the start of the FedEx Cup Playoffs, and make it relevant.

The fact is, at this point, the TOUR is making a stop somewhere that week. And since the likelihood of another event swapping dates with us isn't realistic, Brazil, Bobby Long, Bobby Powell, and the rest of the gang have to hold on as long as possible and do everything in their power to improve what we've got until another date (frankly, any other date) becomes available.

People can argue all they want about which course is more difficult. With all the parameters in play with this thing, that's not really the issue. If you think the pros that show up at our event are coming because of the course, think again. They come because they have a chance to play for almost a million dollar first place check, and not have to beat the top guys in the process (or their just trying to keep their card).

What is true, like it or not, is that the pros are used to certain standards. Not just Phil and Sergio. All of them. Amenities like a fancy clubhouse, mansion lined fairways, and nice hotels nearby. Does that make them elitist? A little bit. But that doesn't change anything from the tournament's perspective, and Sedgefield helps address some of these things. And it's much more centrally located to the Triad. Does Sedgefield have other challenges? Absolutely. Parking, and managing limited space on the grounds for corporate tents and operations facilities will certainly be a struggle. I'm confident that Brazil and his team have a plan to handle all of this.

Deep down, I doubt FOCC members want to see the event "go away" just because it will no longer reside at their club. I am sure there are some who didn't want it there anyway. And this also shouldn't be an opportunity for Sedgefield members to claim victory over another club. There are still so many challenges that have to be over come. I am glad that we still have a tournament. I am thankful that Wyndham sees fit to write the fat checks for a few more years, and I am glad that the tournament committee is not resting on whatever laurels they may think they have (they know better).

Quite a bit of angst over an item that really does not matter in the whole scheme of life.

For what it's worth, the venue has never been the problem with the GGO - the real problems lie with the date and the market. August is a brutal month in our region with temperatures in the 90-degree range and humidity levels over 80%. However, that's not even half of the problem. The biggest reason as to why the tournament has seen declining success over the years is the market - Greensboro - our town. This morning I listened to Jack Murphy discuss the transition from Forest Oaks to Sedgefield, and listened with a growing interest as I have been considering purchasing a home in the FOCC area.

Murphy's biggest point was that for the tournament to be a success at Sedgefield (of which he is a member), the entire Triad needs to be supportive of the event. It should be reinvented to include Winston-Salem, High Point and maybe even Burlington. Greensboro alone cannot support it and does not offer enough of a market to do so. If it's going to continue to be a one-horse game it will fail. Sure, we'll see a temporary increase in attendance this year, simply because of a change of venue, but that will be all. Once the new club smell has worn off, the attendance will decline and Sedgefield residents and members will have to listen to snide comments made by those at other clubs.

But hey, this might end up benefitting me greatly - if Steve Isaacson and Davis McMillan are right, I should be able to buy a home quite readily in FOCC because it isn't a "real community" and the houses have taken a "100k loss." Such rampant ignorance.

Back on track, it seems to me that the club is not the problem for the GGO. It could be held at Grandover, Sedgefield, Forest Oaks, Cardinal, Stoney Creek, etc... and it will fail. The date and the market are its primary problems. If we could pick up any of our wonderful clubs and relocate them to Charlotte or Raleigh, and hold the tournament there, they would most assuredly be a success. Regardless of venue, the GGO is an asset to our community, and I think we need to support it as best we can.

There is angst Sensei because the member at Forest Oaks have been burned and the members over at Sedgefield think they are so high and mighty in the first place and now they are real high and mighty that they have the tournament in their backyard. I personally think the course at Forest Oaks is better, it's like a traditional course you'd see in Pinehurst, but the redesign did screw it up, but it's still a great course when it's in shape. The problem at Forest Oaks is that they don't spend the money on the course or any facilities and so it's gets a bad rap. The new Sedgefield is nice, but not all that and not what people make it out to be. The new Cardinal course is probably better than both of them, but it's all up for debate you know.

To Chris S I would say check your facts because Mark Brazil has done nothing for this tournament. I wouldn't say it's totally his fault, but a big portion of the blame has to fall on him because he is the man in charge. Really check your history and then make a comment. Mark Brazil is a talk first kind of guy and no action. This upcoming tournament will be no diiferent although they should get a few more names and more of a crowd than last based on the course change. The date sucks, but Mark and his gang are running this thing in the ground just like Forest Oaks is running its club in the ground. It's a mess over there from what I hear. Broken promises, raised dues and a staff that has been burned and shows no signs of improving. The best thing for them would be to get the Hattori guy out of there!

Who cares.
Golf is for playing not watching just for the golf.
The players have lost their personality.

The facts are most fans that play really only care about their own game.

If you don’t have Woods you don’t have a tournament let alone a Championship.

Golf lost its soul when the Pebble Beach Crosby became the AT&T something

Whats a Wyndham?.

GGO, Western Open, Westchester, Crosby, Hope
North South, etc.

Hell the Women have the Kraft Nabisco Championship.

I love the spin now. Sedgefield is hanging its hat on being the only Donald Ross golf course on tour. Brazil says he has talked with top players and they are interested in coming. This is a joke, this tourney will flop and move to Raleigh or something. Greensboro isn't going to support a golf tourney. It's sad that it has come to this, but moving to Sedgefield isn't the answer and we'll find that out soon. Unless they move the date and make some changes at the top this thing won't survive. But, in the end the "money" got their way. I hope they fall flat on their face because there is alot behind the scenes that isn't being reported.

As a member of Forest Oaks for 14 years, I am delighted to see this tournament gone. The entire membership golf schedule and maintenance schedule is all of about the tournament. So if you like carts on the path 6 weeks leading up to the tournament, greens not being mowed because of extreme temperatures, pin placements 4 feet from the fringes, and last but not least the course will shut down for 10 days for the tournament. All in all you lose about 2 months of prime golf for this 1 week. Not worth it!!!!!

Forest Oaks will go way downhill now that they have lost the tournament. No updates in years and it will only get worse now. That's ashame. It's not a country club that's for sure.

It's like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titantic, it will do no good. The reasons for it's death are:
(1) Jaycees refusal to make the tournment into a regional one when it could.
(2) Poor economy of Greensboro and few HQs of big/rich companies.
(3) Players want to play at destination resorts or around big cities with big airports.
(4) Extreme prices for snacks/beer.
We have two choices.
(1) Give it up. or
(2) Have PGA take it from us.
I vote for number (1).

May the tournment rest in peace. We did it to ourselves.

Robert Pace is a man who knows what he is talking about.

Mike D., Forest Oaks members probably do feel somewhat burned right now after being "lied" to by Mr. Hattori, and you do make a valid point about him getting out of there, but things could be on the rise as I'll comment about in a minute.

Sam Snead, first off, great name *insert sarcasm*. You have no idea what you're talking about. Forest Oaks is about to undergo $1 million plus renovations and the Nisshin Corp. (Mr. Hattori) has just commissioned Troon Golf to oversee operations at Forest Oaks. Not the "sky is falling" scenario you speak of exactly, huh?

Troon Golf is headquartered in Scottsdale, Ariz., with international offices in Hong Kong, Australia, Switzerland and Dubai, Troon Golf is the world's largest luxury-brand golf management, development and marketing company. Troon Golf's passionate dedication to quality inspires its daily-fee, resort, and private golf experiences, at over 190 golf courses in 32 states and 32 countries. Its private club division, Privé, includes the most elite clubs from around the world. The Privé division is dedicated to delivering a world-class experience while safeguarding the integrity and exclusivity of its private clubs. Every Troon Golf-managed facility is operated with individualized precision and with a goal to meet the highest standard of excellence and member satisfaction.

As I said, despite the tournament moving....which actually isn't a negative thing anyway, Forest Oaks is on the rise with new, young, revitalized members joining steadily.

Newmaniac do you smoke crack? Nothing new has happened at Forest Oaks oh let's say 15-20 years now. That place is a joke! What is Troon going to do, I heard that Japanese guy takes all the money made at FO and sends it down to his other clubs in Florida or something. That club will go semi-private or something. the Cardinal and Sedgefield have always and will always be better clubs. Have fun at your dump!

Sam Snead, thanks for the low blow, I truly appreciate it. It's funny how people like you, when they no longer have a valid argument, resort to personal attacks. Simply more of the childish behavior I spoke of earlier.

Nothing has happened at FO in 15-20 years? How about the redesign some 5 years ago? You, sir, are showing your ass the more you talk. Mr. Hattori doesn't even own the courses in Florida anymore. Get your facts straight the next time you try to engage someone wittier than you in an argument.

I'm glad that you are so self righteous and put yourself on such a pedastal to call Forest Oaks a dump. We are very proud of our Club and I take great offense to that statement. FO is on the up and up and people like you can't stand it. I hope you and your pompous attitude have a great life.

Newmaniac, it is what it is. The golf course redesign was a disaster. The greens are so goofy out there now that even the pros get a good laugh. The old original FO was nice then Fuzzy did his tricks and then Davis who was new to design did his masterpiece which was not good. The best thing they could do at FO is make that course like it used to be where it played like a true old style course like you would find in Pinehurst. I have friends who are members there and Troon isn't going to do anything. That whole thing is a set up to put the place up for sale from what I hear. Nothing has improved there for years and that's a fact. I could walk in that clubhouse today and it's still the same when I played in a member-member there back in the early '90's. The locker room is the same, pro shop, dining area, it's all the same. I just wouldn't hang my hat on the redesign partner because it's a joke. Your japanese owner hasn't sunk a dime into that place and it shows. DUMP! Let me say it again, it's a DUMP!!!!!!!

Let me put a stamp on what Forest Oaks Country Club Membership is all about. It's like having a neighbor that you would never be seen in public with but when times get bad you are right there over at his house. Meaning: When courses like The Cardinal and Sedgefield were shut down with renovations these members were out at Forest Oaks by the bus loads playing for cart fee only and with morning tee times. Now, as soon as these courses opened back up, Forest Oaks members either were not allowed to go play these ELITE courses. or was being given a chance to play at a $50 surcharge with late afternoon tee times available only. Now, is that anyway to treat a nice neighbor!!!!!!!

Robert you really hit the nail on the head. I loved how I would walk in to get a tee time last summer and there were groups from Sedgefield who got preference over me and I'm a member at Forest Oaks. Yeah they all come running when their course shuts down taking our times and now we aren't welcome to come play their new designs. I have choice words for that one.

To Sam Snead you probably aren't even a member of any club first of all and you just want to get on here and stir the pot. Hey, is Sedgefield nicer than Forest Oaks, it may be in your opinion, but you know that comes with alot higher price tag. For the working man who makes a decent living Forest Oaks is pretty good. I can play golf, eat there, take my kids to the pool without it breaking the bank. Could I do that at Sedgefield or the Cardinal probably not. Not many people my age could. I feel fortunate that I can be a member of a club where it's not all full of snooty people and you aren't judged by the size of your wallet. Forest Oaks isn't a luxurious club, but we have a good time and hopefully things will improve with this new group coming in like Newmaniac said.

As far as the tourney goes, I am sad to see it leave because I grew up skipping school to catch the Pro-Am's and it was always a week you looked forward to spending time at the club with your friends. The tourney being played on your home course was something to brag about. Now as it leaves, hopefully G'boro will support it, but as far as people calling Forest Oaks a dump and all, you should check your history and thank us for hosting it all these years when you couldn't or decided you didn't want to. People at Sedgefield were fed up with crowds and what comes with a tournament and all back in the '70's and so Forest Oaks stepped in and did a great job in my opinion. I agree with Newmaniac this tourney went downhill when Brazil came on board and made all these changes, yes check the timeline as the facts are right there. Yes, the PGA changed or changes as some of you had said, but change is not always good and this tourney used to be good. I don't believe that Sedgefield will change this tourney, but that is my opinion and I will always support where I grew up and play golf.

I am not a member of any club nor do I want to be, but I have my opinions of Forest Oaks and that's that. I would rather spend my money on a nicer public course like Bryan Park. Forest Oaks is in turmoil from what I hear. Newmaniac have fun on your goofy greens and a dump of a golf course, it's all downhill now!

Sam Snead, say whatever you want if that makes you feel better. I'm glad you get thrill from degrading our Club. Maybe if you actually belonged to one yourself you'd have the sense of pride that goes along with membership. I'll take my peers at Forest Oaks over asshats like you any day. Like I said, you're words are irrelevant to me now, you and your pompous attitude have a good one!

Everyone is missing the big picture; the real winner here is Forest Oaks:

FOCC will receive over $100,000 per year for over 10 years, and they don't have to host the golf tournament!!!What a great deal!That will pay for a new clubhouse, compliments of Wyndham Tournament. Now we know why they call it the "Charitable Foundation" and FOCC is the benefactor.

Also FOCC had the privilege of hosting the GGO & GGCC tournament in its heyday and boy was it fun. Now with the Wyndham tournament being a 2nd class event, FOCC escapes the burden of hosting tournament in miserable August heat and no name players.

I think that says it all!

I must make a grammatical correction to my last post. I used the wrong form of "your" in my last sentence, which is very unlike me, and it's been driving me crazy.

Charles let's hope you are right. I guess we'll find out March 6th. Up until now it's been a lot of lip service from Mr. Hattori and some staff at FO. Let's see now if he backs it up and if something really does happen this go round! Newmaniac go back to school bro!

Davis Mcmillan better grab that $100K profit quickly. Such inane remarks.

D, I hear ya bro, school me with some knowledege. Let's hope we don't just hear of positive changes on March 6th but actually see them into fruition. I don't hardly see $1 million providing a new clubhouse as Charles suggested though. A million spends up VERY quickly on a commercial project. There's no doubt that the clubhouse is in need of some updating, both upstairs and down, and needs some overall general maintenance to the exterior. Some ladscape lighting around the putting green for nightime viewing from the dining areas would be excellent. Also, as you've heard me say, we need nicer score cards and posts on every hole outlining the hole number and layout. I'd like to see something good come of the dues increase we just had, and by that I don't mean more budget cuts. Hopefully Troon will bring better course maintenance opportunities than ever. I may be totally off base from what the other members are looking for though, I guess we'll find out next Thursday.

Overall, you know I love my Club though. Once again, let's hope for positive changes coming down the pipe!

Personally I don't have much of a problem with the Love redesign...add a few strategically placed loads of dirt on the greens of #2, #6, #8, #13, and #18 and I think it's pretty good. I don't remember the original Maples greens but everything I read says that people liked them; somebody correct me if I'm wrong but I think I've also heard that the original layout was flipped from how it is currently (holes 1-9 used to be holes 10-18?). This seems to make sense...#9 would be a much better finishing hole than #18. Does anyone know the reason Zoeller was asked to redo them in the first place or why the layout was flipped? That combined with the castration of #17 by removing the beer, port-a-johns, and grandstands seemed to mark the beginning of the tournament's downfall. Best of luck to Sedgefield; once the honeymoon's over and they get tired of Joe six-pack wizzing in their million dollar yards, parking in their driveways, and generally trashing the place maybe they'll remember why they ran the tournament off in the first place. We'll be waiting.

So, Hattori is now on the board for the tourney. You guys at FO got hosed and you know it. Maybe Hattori will go and buy Sedgefield and run it into the ground. It's funny how money works and how they all rub each other to get what they want. Hattori gets a fat paycheck, Sedgefield gets the tourney, and FO gets nothing in return but a bunch of ****! HAAAAAA!!!!!!!

I imagine Hattori is on the board to watch after his fat paycheck. If tourney fails at Sedgefield and goes away, then Hattori doesn't receive the remainder of $ from the Forest Oaks buyout. (It's probable Hattori receives $ on a yearly basis only if tourney is played.)

It'll be interesting to see if FOCC gets any of this Wyndham $ for clubhouse improvements?

HATTORI needs to go back where he came from. Get out of NC as he's done nothing for Forest Oaks or this community, but yet he's on the board sitting on high and mighty so he thinks. It's people like him that leave a real sour taste in my mouth and there are no words to express the disgust.