News-Record.com

I want Allen and crew at my next Kentucky Derby Party, or at least have access to them via telephone.

I could charge folks just to hear their pick of the horses.

Damn amazing pulse on the community the way I read it.

Seems like you're pretty much saying the same thing as most of the community, I guess some are never satisfied.

As I have stated before- more telling is that you only endorsed 4 Republicans out of that impressive list of endorsements. Maybe the accuracy of your endorsements is the problem- maybe if you endorsed more Republicans, they might win too. That's the whole point of exposing media bias- to make sure the public is informed and both parties get a fair shake. Your paper should still quitting B.S.-ing around denying the bias and excusing it by saying "it doesn't affect our news page." Why can't you guys simply answer and explain why EVERY election cycle, your ed-board endorses Democrats 4 to 1.

Isn't media bias a news story? Why not have someone in your NEWS division investigate and write a news story about that? Take your ed-board to task. Interview them about what was said during their deliberations. Treat them just like you would any other organization that you are investigating.

Samuel S. Spagnola

Don't confuse what we do on the news pages with the editorial positions.

It seems to me that a consistent editorial position based on long-standing core values makes perfect sense. In a way, it's no different than an individual taking stock of the candidates and issues, matching them with his or her core values and deciding who and what best fits. I would call it opinion, which is what editorial pages do. Calling it bias is like calling someone who votes predominantly for Republicans (or Democrats) biased. They have political opinions, they are voicing them, and there's nothing wrong with that.

As for having our news staff investigate our editorial staff, well, it doesn't make a lot of sense. I think most people understand that editorial pages have agendas and positions. Heck, ours even announces its agenda every year.

Inasmuch as the News and Record seeks to cover and market itself to the entire eastern Piedmont, and multiple counties, its choices in the Presidential and Senatorial races do not reflect its "community". Outside of Guilford County, just about the entire region was for Bush and Burr. I would agree, however, that the newspaper's editorials do not have to reflect your readership. News and Record editorials are largely liberal democratic, and its endorsements reflect that orientation. Someone once said that freedom of speech is a great thing, and that it belongs to the owners of the newspaper. Your op-ed pages, and particularly the page opposite the N+R editorials, have otherwise reflected a diversity of political opinion, and that is very much appreciated.

There's no doubt that endorsements have an influence, that's why The Rhino Times does them too.

I don't think it would be a stretch to say that the N&R endorsement of Kerry could be credited to his 1,300 vote margin of victory in Guilford County. So?

Sure the editorial staff has an opinion, that's what they do. But the calls to get the "bias" of of the news is objectionable. It's really a call to censor anything not agreeable.

The N&R is the most consistently credible local news source. People who are informed by credible news find themeselves sharing an opinion, that's not surprising.

Those who find temselves in agreement with the endorsements of the conservative weekly, on the other hand, are perfectly content to consume their "news" thoroughly pickled by opinion and partisanship. That seems to be okay.

If people find themselves aggitated because their beliefs are at odds with the news, maybe it's not the news.

Well said Craig.

I read the newspapers to find out what is going on with the world. I could care less if Kerry's picture is a half-inch bigger than Bush's or vice versa. I could care less who gets the 18pt headline and who gets the 24pt (or whatever the actual sizes are nowdays). I could care less if one more Kerry supporter was interviewed than Bush supporter. I've got better things to do with my time.

Perhaps if these people would put a little more time into thinking about how to solve the problems in this country and spend a little less time worrying about how the media is presenting them, more good things would get done and the "media problem" would go away.

Here's a challenge. Instead of wasting your time complaining about how the media is presenting the news, try going out and creating some good news of your own. Do something good for the community and I guarantee you'll get all the positive spin you'll ever want.

It appears the GOP got reamed, steamed and dry cleaned in Guilford County. Maybe the GOP Chairman was too focused on "democrat nazi thugs" and not focused enough on electing LOCAL Republcians to office. We will have better results next time!

It's easy to pound the county with your bias view and then use the numbers you helped to create as proof that the community agrees.

Enjoy the competition when it arrives!

Allen wasn't really attempting to prove that the community agrees with him. The writer had said that the editorial pages are out of step with local voters. Allen was simply saying that the numbers don't bear that out, no matter how you look at them.

I -- and I believe Allen does, too -- have a higher opinion of Guilford voters than to think that they can be led like sheep by an editorial. They make up their minds on how to vote.

THE ELECTION RESULTS FROM GUILFORD COUNTY COMPARED TO THE REST OF THE STATE OR NATION FOR THAT MATTER SHOWS JUST HOW OUT OF TOUCH GUILFORD VOTERS ARE. AS FOR ALLEN "NELSON" JOHNSON I'LL BET THAT IF BY SOME MIRACLE ABRAHAM LINCOLN CAME BACK FROM THE DEAD ALLEN WOULDN'T SUPPORT HIM BECAUSE HE IS A REPUBLICAN

I am appalled and embarrassed in front of my friends across the country that Guilford County was one of a handful of counties in North Carolina that John Kerry won.

However, I think the newspaper is less a causal factor and more a reflective microcosm in that result. I don't like what the editorial pages of the News and Record say, but I don't think anybody pays attention to endorsements. Everybody knew who they were going to endorse anyway.

As long as the Simkins PAC runs this city, things will never change. Our school board will continue to be dominated by Dot Kearns and her ilk, taxes will become unaffordable without a reduction in standard of living, and Keith Holliday and his liberal programs will be Mayor-for-Life. Which is one of the reasons I'm leaving the area (and more will follow).

Don't blame the paper. It just reflects the liberal power structure that seems to be immune to challenge.

John, that's fair enough for your paper to have an opinion. What's not kosher is the fact that no one will come out and admit that it is biased to liberals. Of course people have biases, but we're not taught to keep them to ourselves like they teach in journalism school. Perhaps the real question is whether your paper wants to be considered a left-wing publication (like The Nation magazine) or a balanced publication. If you are left-leaning, just come out and admit it so at least we have truth in advertising. It's the denial that drives us nuts.

On your "core values" argument: Why doesn't Allen or someone on the ed-board explain exactly what those "core values" you mentioned are? Don't you think it's a little strange that so few Republican's share those elusive "core values" of the News & Record? Better still, wouldn't it be a great idea if your ed-board not only listed these "core values", but also explained why they believe in them?

I suspect part of the N&R problem is typical of southern liberals and their publications- the need to apologize for the South so as to impress your northeastern friends. The N&R touts itself as a progressive paper, but I often think that you what you view as being progressive is really an apology for southern culture. Gee, if you could only enlighten all these backwoods Republican's down here maybe your liberal friends in New York wouldn't look down on you so much. Maybe we can make the South just like the North, but first we have to get rid of all the rednecks. So we constantly endorse liberals as a way of saying "sorry my northeastern buddies, but at least we're trying."

Mind you, John, I wasn't born down here. I came from Ohio, I have an advanced education, and I am not particularly religious. I say this only to point out what your paper and the rest of the media and Democrats missed during this election cycle. There are a number of people who aren't as uneducated, bigoted, fundamentalist, or backwards as you may think that vote conservative over and over. Maybe it's because many of those southern values that the N&R seems to reject are far more mainstream than you know. Maybe they aren't just southern values, either. Look at that sea of red from Tuesday, and maybe you'll realize that we aren't a divided nation. Most of us pretty much agree- it's those few pockets of blue that have the problem. Perhaps we should apologize for you.

Samuel S. Spagnola

John,
I think you have to agree that Mr. Sam Spag is very articultate and has a commendable abilty to verbalize his conservative point of view. I hjghly recommend him to you as a Guest Columnist from time to time in your newspaper.

I'll let Allen speak for the editorial page and its core values. He publishes two editorials per day so if you've read it long enough to decide that it comes from a liberal point of view, you've probably read it long enough to figure out its core values. But if you want to think of the editorial page as progressive, that's fine. I doubt very many would argue with that characterization. My point, though, is that the rest of the publication tries to hit it straight.

As for the north-south business, where do you come up with these ideas? Apologize for the South? I'm proud of the South...never lived anywhere else, unless you don't count Oklahoma as part of the South (and it is a redder state than NC). Impress Northeastern friends? Don't have any, really, which is a shame, now that I think of it. Don't much care what those in the Northeast think, either.

And it's you who are characterizing conservatives as uneducated, bigoted, fundamentalist or backwards, not me. I know that they aren't that.

And Editor is right. If you want to write for the pages, I'd bet Allen would welcome you.

John, I'm not accusing you personally of disdain for the south, but your editorial board must surely have some apologist qualities. How else can you explain your paper and so many others in the south being so far out of kilter with the populace you serve? Maybe it isn't fair to pose these questions to you because you don't run the ed-board.

All I can say is that there seems to be a very strong apologetic quality from southern progressives. This manifests itself in subtle ways that indicate that the values held by conservatives are based on bigotry, lack of education and religious fervor. There is a clear "I'm from North Carolina and I didn't vote for Jesse Helms" quality from so called intellectuals throughout the south. I think this is particularly strong among the Greensboro intelligencia.

We're so sorry about the Klan-Nazi shootout, not necessarily because it was foolish and deadly (but BOTH sides were equally to blame), but instead because it reinforced the south as a place of rampant racism. We're so sorry for Jesse Helms because he represents bigotry and racism. We're so sorry our citizens vote conservative, they just don't know better. We're so sorry that we don't approve of gay marriage, but our people are unenlightened religious bigots. We really want you sophisticated folks in New York and Boston and Hollywood to like us so we can go to all the really cool parties, and be part of the "in" crowd of the national intellectual elite without people thinking we're stupid rednecks like the people who buy our paper and vote for Jesse Helms. But look, we're trying- we endorse liberals over conservatives 4 to 1, and we have for the past 24 years.

Greensboro wants to be Charlotte, Charlotte wants to be Atlanta, and Atlanta wants to be New York. They all want to be considered sophisticated and big time, and for some reason they seem to believe that you have to be a progressive liberal first. The Dallas Morning News is the only major southern paper that seems to say "if you don't like it, leave". The rest of you seem to resent the people who live near you. You vote blue, and the rest of us morons vote red.

Samuel S. Spagnola

Finally, I forgot to mention that I believe this topic has run its course, and we are now spinning our wheels. I'll be glad to write an op-ed any time and on any topic you guys want. I've never been afraid to debate anyone, anywhere on anything.

Samuel S. Spagnola

The cost of living is too high in Greensboro? As a former resident with fond memories of the area (and former N&R staffer) who now lives in the D.C. suburbs, I can assure you that we miss paying bills in the Triad! It's tempting to move back and just commute five hours each way to work.

Another reason we miss Greensboro is that it was such a lively, intellectual place. (Seriously!) Both major parties have their share of adherents, but I think the Greensboro Republicans don't have all that much in common with the current national GOP strategy, and that's why you won't see a solid "red" in the area. The national GOP frankly runs against the media and academia, and in an area with so many fine colleges, that strategy simply won't fly. But the GOP knows it doesn't need to carry areas like Guilford to carry the nation.

Also, don't forget Greensboro's Quaker heritage. It's not a surprise that a candidate pushing war in Iraq didn't carry the area.

In other words, the Bush campaign simply didn't gear its message toward the typical Greensboro resident. That's not a value statement -- it's simply their choice.

Allen Johnson said: "Whether our picks win or lose doesn't matter to us nearly as much as whether we feel we made informed, principled decisions. That's why we personally interview the candidates in the vast majority of races we endorse in."

Please note that an attempt to make "informed, principled decisions" would mean not arbitrarily discriminating against an entire political party. The N+R editorial staff does that in their endorsement considerations. They do NOT personally interview all of the candidates for the races that they endorse, even local races. They only interview Democrats and Republicans.

I'll back Rusty's call that the Libertarians, Greens, etc., should be interviewed as well. We have a bad habit of covering politics the same way we cover sports -- two teams playing, one team "ahead" or "beating" the other, etc. The truth is messier but more interesting.

Right, Beau, but in NC the only other party with enough support, finances, and manpower to get and stay on the ballot is the Libertarians. The N+R won't have to worry about the Greens or Reforms. We spend $100,000 every 4 years just to stay on the ballot. Only the 3rd largest political party in America has the resources to do that, and that is the Libertariain Party.

If you weren't aware, NC has just about the most draconian ballot access requirements of any state in the nation, except for possibly Oklahoma. They are also, of course, unconstitutional, but since when do people care about that old thing anymore?

Rusty -- Sorry to hear that. I thought a charming, underreported story of the presidential campaign was the sub-campaign of the Libertarian and Green candidates joining forces to get into the debates.